Did the complete replacement of parts (guides, tensioners, chains, hardware) at 55,000 miles a little over two years ago. I was lucky, tensioners were cracked big time and I don't know what was holding the guides together.

 

Sorry for the crappy picture but I also have a 2002 XKR and my chain looks nothing like yours. Strange.

 

I think with a lot of these failures it is as much a time and heat cycle issue. Polymers don't like that sort of treatment so maybe year of build is as important?

 

Morse 'silent running' primay chains were fitted on the late 4.0 motors. See this post by Avos:
https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...59/#post649836

 

Guys,
Forgive me for bringing this back to my earlier questions about removing the crank shaft sprocket. I've gotten to that point but am not quite sold on the chain wrench process that Cabel mentioned earlier (Sorry Cabel), and I'd like to know again if anyone can describe the process of holding the torque converter per the manual in order to loosen the nut as I asked earlier. Of course, if there are other clever methods that you know of, would you please be good enough to share? I'm hoping that everything else about replacing the primary tensioners should be straight forward, but I have to get over this hump first.

Thanks for any suggestions.

 

The 'Workshop Manual Second Edition Released 1999.pdf', section 12.21.14, shows the crankshaft locking tool attached to the pulley itself. It only alludes to locking using a lever on a torque convertor boss as a secondary measure. I can't see this information in the 1st edition (1997).

Member motorcarman advocates the chain wrench/piece of serpentine belt as an alternative to the cam locking tool, and I suspect he's changed a few

Please add your car year/model to your sig (User CP).

 

The Jaguar service manual instructions state emphatically, DO NOT attempt to remove the harmonic balancer/damper bolt with only the torque converter locking pin or cam locking bars, they are not strong enough! You must use either the factory damper locking tool or some other form of "leverage" on the damper itself when trying to remove the bolt. The timing lock tools are ONLY there to hold the correct timing, and not designed to take the torque needed to remove or install the damper bolt.

 

The Jaguar service manual instructions state emphatically, DO NOT attempt to remove the harmonic balancer/damper bolt with only the torque converter locking pin or cam locking bars, they are not strong enough! You must use either the factory damper locking tool or some other form of "leverage" on the damper itself when trying to remove the bolt. The timing lock tools are ONLY there to hold the correct timing, and not designed to take the torque needed to remove or install the damper bolt. Up to you how you want to hold the damper, the chain wrench worked well but I'm sure there's other ways to do it. I couldn't even find the "real" Jaguar tool tho.

 

So I bought the biggest chain wrench I could find (24") and laid in a ribbed serpentine belt for protection and grip and had at the crank shaft pully with that and the 24" breaker bar. The nut seemed to be turning, (The tools were moving) and the chain wrench wasn't slipping, but no progress on the nut. I had my son-in-law (truck builder) come by and we worked it together but found that the outer ring of the crank pully was slipping relative to the inner hub which was still staying with the nut. In effect, the harmonic balancer was giving up, and there was resulting movement (total of less than one half turn) of the crankshaft in the counterclockwise direction. First, I did hear some clicking inside the upper left bank that sounded like it could have been the chain skipping on a sprocket. Second, could the crank movement have done other internal bearing damage?, 3 What's next to get that pully off? I'm thinking that I may have to pull the radiator in order to get enough room to go in with an aggressive air impact wrench. Any other suggestions? Is there any issue about pulling the radiator relative to the transmission lines or AC condenser?
Thanks,
Mark

 

Mark,

That sucks if it's slipping, as replacement dampers are not cheap. You could try the old trick of putting a breaker bar on the crank nut, with the end of the bar on the floor then "bumping" the starter, but the safer method may be just removing the radiator and using an impact driver. Use some light heat on the crank bolt, as there's a TON of factory applied thread locker on it and it "binds", making the bolt much harder to remove. The heat helps to soften it up enough to ease removal. Mine was a PITA until I hit it with a propane torch for a bit.

 

I have a very mysterious engine ticking noise and need a little help from you guys. As most of you know I replaced the secondary tensioners years ago with 41,000 miles on the car. The thread was made a sticky which I am proud of. I thought I could let the primary parts go for some time as I didn't feel capable of doing that job then. The car now has 68,000 miles and has developed a funny noise. Funny noises are bad. When I start the cold engine it sounds perfect. Really smooth sounding. Then I drive the car for just a few miles and stop and raise the hood. It has a sharp ticking noise in the left bank. Using a stethoscope the tick is sharp and between the oil cap and the front hump of the cam cover. It is in frequency with the cam rotation. Using the scope on the front of the cover the tick is not near as loud. It is hard to imagine that the primary chains are causing this tick. And why is it not there on a cold engine right after initial start up.

Ok, guys I really would like your input. I would think that with only 68,000 miles that the primary parts would still be OK since I never drive the car hard.

 

I'd pull the cover and get a bore scope down in there, and not drive it until checked.

 

I agree.

 

After illness, injury, work travel, the govt furlough, waiting for parts and tools (some back-ordered) and night classes conspired to drag this project out over several months, I finally got my Jag back together. The noise is now gone! So quiet in fact, that now I am able to hear the failing bearings in my supercharger.....

I ordered the supercharger "snout overhaul" kit from SuperchargersOnline, Worlds largest Supercharger Resource. Get Serious About Power and it came today. Looks like a nicely packaged set of factory Eaton parts, even comes with supercharger oil and locktite. So this weekend I plan on tearing back in and getting that done. Good thing I enjoy my "alone time" in the garage, lol.

 

Rather than find creative ways to damage things such as the crankshaft damper and more, spend 50 bucks to rent or 150 bucks to buy the kit from Christopher's Foreign Car Parts. You need three feet of leverage. You need a torque wrench capable of 300 foot pounds.
Once you destroy the damper by using a strap wrench, you've blown $150 to repair the damper trying to save $50 on the tool kit.
And you still don't have the proper tools, so what's the logic?
Save yourself time and money.
Do yourself a favor and view this thread: https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...ioners-214569/
I detailed all the issues I encountered and how I successfully resolved them.
Seriously, this is not a big deal with the proper tools.
Screw this up and you'll regret it.
Here are some pictures from my tensioner project.

This is the tool kit for the crankshaft bolt and damper.

This is how you position the tool for bolt removal. Note the piece of wood under the tool handle to prevent damage.

This is how you position the tool to install and torque the bolt. The tool slips nicely under the sway bar.

 

OK, My turn to report in. Got the Damper back from rebuild by Winslow Mfg in Wendell NC last Friday. Looked beautiful. Painted it and installed it on Monday. Used my son-in-law's 250 ft/lb torque wrench. Mounted the holding tool to the damper, slid on the 1 1/2" ID steel extender to the tool, set that extender on my shoulder as I leaned in from the driver's side, and pulled with both hands on the torque wrench. Once the torque wrench clicked, I pulled some more. Definitly brought it within the 268 - 385 ft-lb range. Everything else went together nicely, and then I tried to start her up. First cranking with throttle to the floor so I could crank her with no gas going in to get some oil up. Then I let up and cranked to start. No start. Just near free cranking. Tried again and no attempt to fire. I remembered this happening once before when it seemed that she lost compression. The car has sat all winter without running so I went in and checked for compression. Only got 60 ft-lbs. I pulled all the plugs and got some marvel mystery oil in each to help lube and seal. Tried again and no difference. As a last resort I detached the battery (and charged it) to see if it would help to reset the computer. When I tried again, I finally got a spit. Encouraged, I kept at it going from full to no throttle until I got her to fire. Once running she sounded great. Smooth and quite. Since then I ran her a number of times and had no problems starting her. Just have to keep her active and driver her more often. Almost forgot how great it is to drive this car. A real treat.

One note to consider. Being 22 years old, my damper was totally hardened and brittle when taken apart. It was probably not doing anything in the way of actual damping, which may be part of the reason the engine feels so smooth now in comparison. That, plus the correct timing chain lengths. So if you have your damper off, it might not be a bad idea to get it rebuilt to add that little extra smoothness back to you ride. Only costs $105.00.

Enjoy,
Mark

 

All,

Just to be clear, the crankshaft locking tool (303-191 or 18G-1437) Stu mentions won't work on the Supercharged engines without the additional adapter (303-191-02 or 18G-1437-2) which is very hard to source (at least here in the USA) and is an additional $100 or so. The supercharged damper is much deeper (two pulleys, not just one) than on the normally-aspirated engines, and the tool won't reach the bottom of the damper. The adapter gives you that added "depth" of reach into the damper. Also on the supercharged dampers, the outer cog is solid (no rubber dampening material) so a chain wrench may be used to hold it without risk of damaging the rubber damper material, as the rubber section is on the inner cog.

Also, some 1997-On XK's can experience a loose damper pulley. See the attachment for the fix. It mentions the damper bolt torque is set by using a standard torque wrench to 59 ft./lbs (80nm), THEN using a torque angle gauge ($12 on Amazon) to torque it to an additional 80 degrees. This will set the final torque at the recommended 320-400nm (236-295 ft/lbs). The attached service recommendation also recommends using green locktite on the shaft to damper mating surfaces to prevent slippage.

 

Gentlemen, Thank You!!! This is a great thread, I've changed timing chains on old 4.2 E types but this XK 8 4.0 is new to me! Could not do this without the help of this forum. The damper remover tool from Christopher's Foreign Car worked great and made a difficult job easy..I have 101,000 miles on the car and PO had changed the secondary tensioners but he didn't do the primaries. The primaries were slapping and when I got the timing case cover off today you could see where parts were breaking off and slowly falling into the oil pan with the B bank guide being in the worst shape of all. Will replace all 4 chains and all tensioners, the crank seal, water pump and timing case gaskets and valve cover gaskets. Welsh Jaguar has a sale on water pumps with a metal impeller (not plastic) so that and the thermostat and related gaskets are being replaced as well. Does anyone think I should replace the oil pump since I have to drop the pan and clean out the old broken guide and tensioner parts? It looks like the pan will be fairly easy to drop and clean out but when ever something looks easy on a Jaguar there's some lesson headed my way. Any advice is welcome!

 

I wouldn’t worry about swapping out the oil pump. When you drop the oil pan, unbolt the sump pick up tube . It’s held on with two bolts. Clean thoroughly. I washed mine under the hot water in the kitchen sink. Shake the loose debris out and continue to rinse until clean. Dry and reinstall. There’s an O ring there on the tube.

ltd

 

Thanks for your feedback. that confirms what I thought but wasn't sure because no experience with this engine.