I am glad I found this site. I thought I was the only one who was having problems, buy I see I am not alone.


I currently own a 2006 Jag S Type. When the car reached 62,000 miles I kept hearing a dinging sound in the engine. I took the car to the local Jag dealer and the next day I received a call from service writer telling me the car had blown a lower engine bearing. I asked what the fix was, and the service writer said there was no fix, the car needed a new engine, and the cost was about $17,000. After a moment of silence I responded by saying "I am sure glad I purchased the extended warrantee." To which the service writer asked, "who did you purchase that from?" "From you guys, I promptly replied." After a whole lot of hassle, and the intervention of Jag USA, the car did eventually get a new engine under the warrantee, and my cost was $100.


The car now has 140,000 miles, and has 102 miles left on the extended warrantee. While driving it I got a reading saying there was a GEARBOX FAULT. After taking the car to the dealer I was told they first had to reset the program to see if that fixed the problem. The cost was $475 and was not cover by the extended warrantee. I was further told that if the program reset did not fix the problem the car needed a new transmission and the extended warrantee would cover the cost. Based on that statement from the service writer I authorized the program reset. The program reset did not fix the problem, and the service writer said the warrantee company would not cover the $7000 cost for a new transmission because there was a leak in the transmission line, and that was the cause of the transmission failure. This was said without dropping the transmission pan, and without an internal inspection of the transmission to determine what the failure was due to. I asked the service writer how there could be a leak in the line if there was never any fluid on the garage floor, and I never got any low fluid indicator? I was told it is a sealed unit, and if there is a leak in the line it would leak into a sealed pan and I wouldn't have seen any fluid on the floor, and there is no warning indicator to let the driver know of the leak.. I called Jag USA and they told me their only obligation on the car is the 50,000 warrantee, and I couldn't expect the car to go 140,000 without mechanical problems. I do not know about anyone else, but when I buy a world class automobile and spend $70,000 on the car, I fully expect it to last more tan 140,000. I would also expect the engineering to be such that the car would have some type of warning signal to let the driver know if the fluid is low, especially since there is no way the owner can check the fluid level, and if there is a leak it will not leak on the floor to let the owner know there is a potential problem.


Bottom line is I took the car to an independent transmission repair shop. When the transmission pan was dropped and the transmission was inspected, it was very clear that the problem was due to normal wear and not because of low fluid level. My only recourse at this point it to either eat the cost of the transmission repair, or to file a suit against the Jag dealer and or the warrantee company for the cost of the repair that should have been covered under the extended warrantee. In any event I will never buy a Jag product again.

 

Yes I agree. Please let us know which manufacture makes cars where no failures occur, ever. I'll be first in line to buy one.

Sounds like your issues are more to do with humans (in)correctly administering warranty polices in response to technical findings than an unreliable automobile.

It also sounds like you're not too familiar with your car. It does not have the 5 speed Ford transmission discussed in the posts above. Those were discontinued at the end of the 2002 model year. Yours has a 6 speed ZF unit. Nothing in common.

 

Welcome to the forum mdsmith,

I've moved your post to a new thread as it's not relevant to the earlier transmission.

Please follow this link New Member Area - Intro a MUST - Jaguar Forums - Jaguar Enthusiasts Forum to the New Member Area - Intro a MUST forum and post some info about yourself and your vehicle for all members to see. In return you'll get a proper welcome and some useful advice about posting to the forum.

Graham

 

Welcome to the forum.

The transmission lines leaking are very, very common on the ZF transmissions. It occurs in the area where the crimped metal meets the rubber lines. Both the S Types and X350 cars suffer from this condition. (I own a 04 XJ8 and my lines are currently leaking also - of course I find this right after servicing my transmission pan/filter, fluid and sealing sleeve and new T40 pan bolts)

If you have your lower valiance panel and engine lower shield installed - the seeping transmission fluid would collect at the bottom of the panels and dissipate or absorb into the spongy material...

Leaking transmission lines if not dealt with can cause a severe loss of transmission fluid over time. Other sources of transmission fluid loss is the pan (plastic) or the sealing sleeve.

If your transmission has flashed a "gearbox fault" there should be a code(s) present.

Also, these transmissions are not sealed for life - if the fluid/pan wasn't ever serviced then odds are the transmission failed over time to degraded fluid quality/loss of fluid.

Possibly share them with us.

At 140+K miles - $7K is a lot of dough to throw at a car...

Just my $0.02

Thanks and good luck.

 

Hello normally this code if this is the code lies at the module and can usually be reprogrammed. and it will require the ecu reprogramming also. At times if the program doesn't successfully take then a new tcm will be needed. Unless so evidence of internal damage to tranny the I personally doubt the tranny is issue.

 

I don't know what that was all about but do this.

Get the code!!!
.
.
.

 

big +1 post the code(s)

 

Me neither, but the post was originally attached to an old, long-dead series of comments about the 5 speed Ford gearbox.

Don't know if the poster wants some help or it's just another drive-by rant.

 

Tbird I thought I posted the code but here it is,this is the only code I'm aware of with the zf. This is the code that is related to what was posted.Hope it helps.

 

We're asking the OP to post his codes, rather than you to post one. There are many for the ZF...

 

I don't think the OP has any intention of reading codes or doing any sort of DIY or was even asking a question. He just wanted to find a website to substantiate his suspicions about the marque's quality and let fellow owners know that the cars are cr*p.

Very probably this type of ranting will be come more common as the S-type fleet ages and falls out of daily service into a life of obscurity, save us few diehards that appear to have gotten a handle on the beast and know how to deal with them.

I also predict an increasing rate, although this is an obvious trend, of young, penniless and technically inexperienced owners who pick these cars up for a song 'because they always wanted a Jag'. They don't realize that although the vehicle may be structurally sound it probably needs at least 5 times it's purchase price in complex mechanical or electronic repairs that are well beyond the skill levels of 99% of owners.

Sigh.

 

True enough, Mikey.

But in this case, it appears the OP bought his S-Type new, paid $70K for it, and even had the foresight to purchase an extended warranty. He probably also had the means to take care of his car during his 8 years of ownership.

Notwithstanding those factors, he's had to replace the engine at 62,000 miles and the transmission at 140,000 miles. This is not like a Jaguar at all, is it? I can't blame him for his frustration. IMHO this is NOT the experience of the typical S-Type owner who posts on this forum. It sounds to me like the OP had the misfortune of buying a lemon. I'm sure even Jaguar produces them once in awhile.

The indie trans shop says the trans failed due to normal wear, not low fluid level (from a leak). So I do wonder if the trans has ever been serviced?

If his car is routinely serviced at a dealership but they failed to recommend trans service at the appropriate interval, could the OP argue that the dealership is at least partly responsible for the premature failure of the trans? If so, maybe he can negotiate splitting the cost of trans repair with the dealership.

If the dealership recommended trans service and the OP ignored the recommendation, it seems reasonable that the OP eats the cost of trans repair.

And if the trans did receive service at its recommended interval and still failed at 140,000 miles, then I reiterate my lemon theory.

 

Those are some good points and maybe if we (I) am classifying posters, it's rather rare to see an original owner sign up after 8 years and 140K of ownership to issue a single rant then leave without asking a single question.

Whether the car is a bona fide lemon, I'm not so sure. It is rare to hear of an engine going bang at 60K miles (age unknown) but all machines are subject to occasional random failures and that's what warranties are for. The OP got a whole new one for free. Most of us would have tried to fix the existing one or fit a used unit in the absence of warranty.

The 6 spd. ZF transmission in the 2003 and up (the OP thought he had a Ford 5 spd) has long been known to need a fluid change at around 80Kish miles to ensure longevity. As you've correctly pointed out, it's unknown whether the OP or his dealer was up to speed on this but the outcome of it letting go unserviced is pretty predictable.

Having the two expensive failures over a 140K mile period is frustrating, but I never expected my own carJag to be more reliable than a more mainstream manufacturer and just assumed that the costs would be 2 to 3 times more if I were to be unfortunate.

So far so good.

 

The warranty company is looking for a way out. Here is my suggestion:


File a claim in small claims court. Name the warranty company, the individual who wrote the policy, the service writer, the dealership and anyone else connected with this matter. A leak in the line will cause the car to lose hydraulic pressure eventually. With the mileage on the car, the transmission is shot and they wrote the policy and assumed the risk for the price of the policy. It is simple contract law.


Some states allow for triple damages for fraud. Avoiding a claim may be considered as fraud. I'd go that direction immediately.

 

No question that the warranty company is looking to avoid its obligation. Note that the OP is looking at possibly a $7000 repair, which might exceed the maximum $$ damage amount that can be filed in small claims court. Also, there is a discrepancy regarding the cause of his tranny failure - was it a leak per the dealership, or wear and tear per the indie shop? This may, or may not, prove critical in determining if the warranty coverage applies.

Now would be a good time to get some advice from an attorney.

 

Most jurisdictions allow for $10k for small claims. You can ask triple damages while in court.


The burden of proof is on the warranty company.

 

If the OP ever drops by for another visit, we might learn that the warranty clerk was just slightly hasty in making his decision as to whether the condition is covered or not.

If were still horrified that a high-end semi-exotic machine might break despite the outrageous sums we pay for them, conside the plight of this new owner

First 2015 Chevy Corvette Z06 engine blows up at just 891 miles

 

Ouch!

Surprised to gather that one was a manual gearbox and wouldn't defend itself by cutting revs/fuel if, as suggested, it was shifted to 1st instead of 3rd. Really? Eek.

 

The comment about erroneous downshifting was the speculation of some journalist, not based on any fact. Not sure how an engine could defend itself if the drivetrain was back driving it into over speed territory.

 

Oh for an autobox! I suppose I'll never get another manual

I figured the car mentioned would have an autobox.