Been a while since I've made a thread but here goes.

Well, after quite a substantial drive in the Jag (4 hour drive, 300 miles) I've noticed a lot of people getting pissed off and overtaking me. It seems that I have to slow down to 40 or 50mph (on a 60mph country road) at mild corners just to keep on the road whilst everyone else is able to miraculously cruise past without even touching the brakes. I've tried to push the car through the corners but she just starts to swing out wide and it feels like she's struggling for dear life just to stick to the asphalt. Plus everyone inside is squished into the doors from all the force. And then I see these massive vans just breezing past well over the speed limit.

Need new tyres or am I just steering really badly? Any insight appreciated.


Also had my first "jesus christ" moment on this drive too. Some guy in a black hatchback was driving erratically between 30 and 50mph and all the twenty cars behind him weren't overtaking for 15 minutes. Then all of a sudden the guy in front of me slams his brakes. Of course... at that moment I had to be admiring the comely hill to my left before suddenly noticing the brake lights flashing in front of me. Slammed my brakes too but I was only inches behind and had to swerve left to avoid him. Miraculously I managed to wedge and stop the car centimetres from his car and the hard shoulder. I was soooo close to ramming into him or shafting off the side of his car but... when I looked over to their car inches away, all his family were just staring on ahead like nothing happened at all (radio must be too loud). The only one that noticed was this little girl in the back who just stared at me crying (SORRY!). Meanwhile the driver in the black car appeared to have stopped with his hazard lights flashing. Lesson learned: don't drive so close to the guy in front, even if everyone else is.

Several millimetres of tyre tread melted from that one.

 

Sounds like you need to take it to a shop that does suspension/chassis work. It would be nice to know how many miles/Kms are on the car. I'm assuming the car has a lot of body roll when cornering and this is causing the discomfort while cornering. It could be worn struts. Worn springs. Possibly worn bushings especially at the anti-roll bars. Perhaps even an anti-roll bar has come unhooked.

Are there any strange noises while hitting bumps or cornering?
Is there excessive nose dive when hitting the brakes?
Or excessive rear end squat when accelerating?

 

Hi, thanks for the help.

The car has done 42000 miles and yes, there is a lot of body roll and excessive understeer at only mildly higher speeds, even when trying to turn more tightly. It has been fully serviced by the dealer very recently though but this is something I guess I've had ever since I bought the car, but only noticed it on this drive. Definitely when I'm going over speed bumps I can hear this creaking springy/rattling noise when the front wheels pass over it (and it's getting worse lately). Not sure about the nose dive since I don't brake that hard and there doesn't seem to be any rear end squat when accelerating.

My driveway is extremely steep and the car can't find enough grip to get up unless I take it at some speed (probably need new tyres). Is it possible that I damaged something by doing this?

 

A service won't even look for such things unless you specifically ask (not a service issue).

You might like to find a good place to take it and explain in detail what's wrong. Maybe go for a demonstration drive with an actual mechanic. You've described a very sick car

 

Kaibiagan, as Skidtz suggests, your due for struts/shocks and a 4-wheel alignment.

 

I don't follow several of the statements- 'car swinging out wide, yet the passengers are squished against the doors' seem contradictory as does the mention of understeer when turning tightly. The follow on issue about not having the grip to get up the drive is a bit baffling also.

I would say that there haven't been enough symptoms and info presented to even guess at what might be wrong other than the car needs to see a specialist right away.

 

The big ones have been said all ready. I'll say +1 to sway bar, and add that if your alignment is off it can GREATLY affect cornering. Especially in combination of other suspension issues. Also, not trying to poke you in the eye, but are your driving smooth or trying to throw it into the corner? Any quick change in throttle, brake, or steering input changes the weight balance of the vehicle affecting how it behaves.

 

My apologies Mikey. The part on 'passengers squished against the doors' was a bit of exaggeration. As for the driveway it is, as I said, it is very steep and is covered in a lot of loose smallish stones. It needs a new surface but I'll be moving out soon anyway.

But, when driving I try as much as possible to ensure that the passengers and the car don't roll during corners/roundabouts. That involves, of course, gentle steering into the turn and the selection of an appropriate speed. I just feel that I should be able to go a bit faster and turn a bit sharper without experiencing as much body roll as I have.

I mean, when sitting as a passenger in my mother's car (Mercedes C-Class) she is able to go round the bends much faster than I could without the same problems as I have (although the passengers are definitely jostled around the sidewalls). I have driven other smaller cars such as the new hybrid Jazz for comparison as well.

To add to the symptoms, the car used to shake at low speed after I accidentally reversed over a brick someone left on the driveway but this went away after a few days. As a lay man I would guess the wheels need rebalancing too.

Thanks for your insight SchultzLD. I do hope it's just my driving but I'm not sure it would be. I suppose I won't drive the car until I can afford a new set of tyres and get everything checked out.

 

I have sports cars. The S Type has a very refined and capable suspension but I'd never consider it a sports car. There is always some compromise between handling and comfort. I consider it a luxury sedan with very good road manners.

It would be very hard for anyone to diagnose the problem without driving and inspecting the car. I would sugest a trip to a good 4 wheel alignment shop first off. Around here a good shop inspects all the steering and suspension bits plus tire condition/air pressure before they ever begin. I used to work on a frt end machine so I know. They should also road test the vehicle. You should ask them about the procedure and voice your concerns. Then you could post back here for opinions on the findings. Do this before you buy tires.

 

That fleshes things out a bit better. Loose stones underneath wide summer tires will ensure wheel spin every time. This has nothing to do with the other issues. The wheel shake may indicate a bent rim, far more serious issue than simple balancing can address.

For the handling, it seems that your concern is more to do with body roll than actual understeer. Again, I'd suggest that the car be taken to a specialist for inspection and road test.

For the record, understeer or oversteer usually are not apparent to a driver until the limits of tire traction are met or exceeded. A common example of oversteer is cornering on an icy or snowy road and the rear end of the car swings out or 'fishtails'. Understeer would be observed when trying to turn a non-ABS equipped car with the front wheels partially or fully locked. IOW, the car tends to plow straight ahead.

 

With my S-type, as with the XJ6 previously, it corners without drift, tyre squeal or body roll. Most following vehicles who try to get round the bends as I take them (I'm a hypermiler -- I don't lose kinetic energy) seem to end up in trouble or a very long way behind after the bend.
A full check of tyre condition, pressure (and make), full steering and suspension geometry, a shocker test (it's usually bushes that fail and rattle), full four wheel alignment, would be indicated to me. With my S-typeD, 35lbs. pressure in front, 32lbs. in back appear to be about right, i.e. the point where the fuel consumption flattens out. (Tyres are what it came with, 245 by 45 by 17). Research has shown that excessive tyre pressure does not improve fuel consumption, whereas low-ish pressure certainly worsens it..
Leedsman.

 

I'm guessing I should also get the brake noise/creak during low speed braking checked out too?

There's also an audible hissing when braking but I'm guessing that's standard (maybe I should stop guessing).

 

So I got the car checked out at the garage and went with one of the mechanics for a test drive.

I was pretty stunned at how hard he was throwing the car through corners and he came to the verdict that everything was fine with the handling of the car. So that's good.

Addressing the brake noise, the mechanic said it wasn't worth fixing and was pretty standard for a car of this type and age.


The creaky suspension was isolated to the LHR lower suspension arm bush. The mechanic greased it (which they're charging £98.00 for, including the cost of investigating the fault) but it was still making noise so they're quoting me £495.00 to replace it all. To me that sounds expensive for something that won't help it pass its MOT. Warranty won't cover it since it isn't a mechanical fault. And if it does evolve into a mechanical fault, it's gotta be me who investigates what's wrong otherwise I'll be paying another £200.00 to get it diagnosed (by these dealers).

On the A/C, the dealer said they'd have to take the car to the Jaguar technicians which is, again, going to cost me some pocket. And if they don't think it's a mechanical fault, I've gotta pay more to fix it... plus it'll probably break again. So I think I'll leave it too. But the car was sold under the premise that the a/c worked and it clearly doesn't... so I think they should fix it.


Probably won't get the car checked out by the dealer again. It's a Honda dealership and they sell a few used Jags (which are covered by the Honda approved used car guarantee).

 

Kaibigan,

How long have you had the car? If it's new to you, it may be a case where you're not familiar with it yet. The test drive comments with the mechanic suggests that it might be the case. I've found my S-Type (2005) to be a pretty good handler. My biggest problem is running up on the cars or trucks I am following.

On the a/c issue, you mentioned the car had a warranty. This should cover the a/c but I would check with the warranty office first.

Good luck,

Mike

 

It's not rocket science for them to fix the a/c. Surely they should just do it.

 

Dollars to donuts it's a DCCV and a fried climate control module. Those seem to be the a/c systems major weak points.

 

My S-Type has considerably more mileage than yours and I find that It drives and handles very well. As previously mentioned, it's not a sportscar but a nice sports sedan, so don't ask for F1 performance. We get fairly severe winters here and the car is extremely stable and with good snow tires on slipery roads has great traction for a RWD automobile.
BTW, Understeer is when you hit the wall with the front of the car, oversteer is when you hit the wall with the rear. *I know, that's an old one but couldn't resist!

 

Good example matty on the understeer vs oversteer