Hi all again - My previous post described the issue I had when I used the wrong (the supplied with the shock) nuts for my new shocks, which ended up pulling the center bearings out of the strut mounts due to not being flanged.

I had them pressed back into place, they then seemed just like before, no play in the bearing, rotated smoothly. I reused the old spacers and factory nuts for the top of the shock shaft, tightened and installed everything. Upon lowering the car to the ground we torqued the top nut to spec (which seems fairly low at 47nM.) as well as the top retaining nuts (3) to whatever the spec was (even lower).

When test driving it (prior to alignment) there is a fair amount of clunking, i.e. there shouldn't be any and there IS. We believe we have isolated it to the top of the struts. When we bounce the car by hand as hard as possible, we can hear and even see a little movement in the top of the shock nut.

We believe that the clunk means that there is space between the bearing, the spacer, and the nut?

Suggestions? Does anyone have an actual picture of the spacer? I reused what came on mine and they look like small brass or gold colored rings, not like a flat washer, more like a wedding ring...

Can I (should I) torque that nut down more? Or did I just get crappy Sachs mounts/bearings? Or did I perhaps install something wrong. I did align the arrow with the long axis of the car (direction of travel) so I did that correct. Everything feels and felt solid when putting it together, but obviously real road forces are far stronger.

The ONLY thing suspension related that was not replaced were the tie rods (inner and outer), but that's more steering related. And the springs, no rust or wear on them. New Control Arms (Moog), new Bilstein shocks, new Swaybar bushings (Rein), new strut mount bearing assemblies (Sachs comes as compete sets), new Swaybar links (Lemforder, exact same as what came off), new wheel bearings...

No alignment yet, it steers fine although it does not recenter itself particularly well, i.e. it'll keep veering off if you turn and release the wheel.

Any help appreciated, thanks.

 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BeZ1flDFJZ0

 

Thanks, I've watched that several times before doing the job. It does not answer the question. I've also read the Jaguar repair manual.

 

The other part that causes noise is the sway bar bushings…on my 2005 it took forever to find the cause of the noise and only after replacing everything else. Jaguar redesigned the sway bar bushings and it is the revised type that is supplied now. Noise gone.

 

Was it a "clunk" akin to a hammer hitting part of the frame? I did replace the bushings with Rein units manufactured within the last two years, they replaced original units. The new ones closed up the gap between them and the bar running through it completely (old ones had a couple of mm of daylight showing but little noise. I also replaced the end links with the Lemforder plastic body ones that matched the ones on the car exactly. Those appear and feel snug when crawling under the car and trying to shake them. I suppose it can't hurt to try to snug the swaybar brackets more just in case although the bar when not connected to the links is now quite hard to move so it seems to be well clamped.

But I am considering disconnecting one end of the sway bar links on each side and driving around the block to see if that can isolate (remove or confirm) the clunk. Obviously would need to wire up the loose end somewhere to be sure it doesn't fall and damage itself or something else. Anyone tried something like that?

Could it be that when I took the shocks out of the knuckles and spread the area held by the pinch bolt that when putting the shocks back in and torqueing the pinch bolt to spec (with new hardware in this case) that the spread area didn't close up all the way (i.e. it isn't being "pinched" accurately) and now the shock absorber itself is moving up and down and causing the clunk? Perhaps a dab of paint on the bottom edge where it protrudes under the knuckle might answer that.

 

I’m curious as to what you’ll discover. My 2002 3.0 has a “clunk” in the front on both sides when I drive over a bump or expansion joint in roads. It sounds like the shocks are extending to their limit. I’ve checked the shock as had Firestone and everything look good and all parts are tight. The bumpers are in good shape as well. The shocks are OEM.
The ride is smooth and only sound when the wheels “drop” over a bump

 

That's EXACTLY the noise I'm experiencing, a metal on metal clunk, not a rattle or jingle and it sure sounds like it's coming from the upper strut area. It's especially bad when both wheels hit the bump (like an expansion joint or a frost heave) at the same time, likely due to both sides doing so in unison.

I'm assuming you mean a regular bump like you'd hit all the time, not something totally severe as in dropping off a curb and the wheels hanging in the air momentarily or charging into a parking lot driveway at full speed and the shocks would reach either of their end limits, just normal stuff at normal around town speeds.

It almost (to me) sounds like the top of the shock when tightened still has play between the top of the shock rod, the inner bearing of the strut mount, the spacer and then the nut. I can't figure out if the nut actually pulls all of that together completely as one unit. Now kicking myself as I could have test assembled all of that BEFORE undoing it again to mate it with the springs. As I recall I compressed the springs enough to put the mount etc over the rod and then tightened it (and torqued it once on the car) to pull it all together before releasing the spring tensions but I don't think the springs were so compressed as to actually be loose between the base and bottom of the mount if that makes sense. Yes the springs were oriented correctly and hit the stop at the bottom and are cradled nicely by the mount. In my case the parts that came out were original Jaguar parts (the mountts/bearings from late 2004 and 168k miles ago) and I reused the top nut and the spacer and the spring, all of which look like the correct factory parts and eliminate them as the problem as it didn't make this particular noise before.

 

Well it is NOT the sway bar bushings or the end links. I took the links off, rotated the sway bar so it was not going to interfere with the axle or control arm and drove around the block. Still clunking/rattling. Came back and the bar was still in the same position as I had moved it to. So I put it all back together and drove it again, same noises.

I then took it to my indy that I use for various things in various cars that I don't want to do, he went for a ride with me, thinks it's likely strut related but didn't have a spare lift open to get under it. When I told him the torque specs for the nuts holding the strut to the tower and for the center nut, he thought the center nut value especially seemed very low. (X-type calls for 50Nm, an equivalent year Audi A4 is 60Nm and the BMW 3-series is 64Nm.) He says he just puts his 1/2" electric impact wrench on it and cranks it down, when it's tight it makes the hammering noise! I figured I don't have much to lose so came home and put my own cordless 1/2" impact wrench on it, but the shaft just spins so the whole thing just spins...Maybe I'll loosen the center nut the whole almost off and try it again so it has a running start? Kind of at my wit's end and as little as I want to pull the whole thing out and try again with perhaps the pricier factory strut mounts, am starting to be resigned to that...

It REALLY sounds like there is play somewhere between the shaft top, the bearing above that, the spacer and the top nut but that doesn't really make sense (I don't think) since the top nut is hard against the metal collar in the strut mount so where would the shaft move? It doesn't seem like it can unless internally it's compressing the mount somehow? The road force is obviously putting far greater force on the unit from the bottom and that force varies whenever it hits a bump...

I'm trying to keep a stiff upper lip...

 

Don't suppose you can find another X-Type sitting on a second hand dealer's lot somewhere close by.
Something that you might be able to visit and kick the tyres (tires) of, with the view to looking under the hood and do your bounce test to see if you replicate the shock nut movement in that one like you described earlier in yours?

 

Yeah, there aren't many around here anymore. I see far more in the junkyard than on the streets. There is however one that lives a few streets over though, I could probably ask them to let me take a look.

I bounced it again at my mechanic's this afternoon, and could see a little movement (no noise this time), but he concurred that's pretty normal, with bouncing it as hard as possible it'll flex a little inside the strut tower as the mount IS partially rubber, so that's by design. It didn't seem abnormal. I'm probably just going to bite the bullet and buy a set of genuine Jaguar mounts and bearings, it's about $300 for the front set. Annoying but hopefully that cures it. The worst part is taking it all apart again and hoping I don't damage anything else or cause something else to act up....

I wonder if the temperature is doing anything too, it's currently been about minus8C here as the high for the last few days.

 

I have a front end clonk in mine (since I got the car a year ago) which I haven't yet got around to.
Did the front sway bar isolation test also without any reduction.
Bought in front and rear sway bar bushings anyway...fitted rears as that was easy along with rear bump stops which had reverted to oatmeal flakes.
Back end is good now, front end will be shocks and top mounts too.
They are horrendously expensive here, so waiting for logistics to start to settle down a bit and will bring some in from USA or UK directly. No hurry for me...the roads I travel have been pretty well repaired since the quakes.

Have a friend that runs his own European car service garage....go in there an there are Lambo's, Bentleys, Jags, Audis, Ferraris and Range Rovers wall to wall.
He is Jag certified (was service manager at the major dealership here before striking out on his own).
He suggested to me that front shocks are the stubborn clonk to find in the X front end. Over the years they have tried various bushings first, but shocks and top mounts usually resolve if it isn't the sway bar bushings slogged out.

 

New Jaguar factory mounts and bearings are about US$300, or at least that's the least pricy option I've found so far, from Harper Jaguar online. The Sachs units were half that - assuming they really are Sachs and not just whatever in a Sachs box, it's not like the name is actually branded on the items. Then there are multiple other options with various names, most of which I don't recognize, for less, no thank, too much work to risk it again. The Bilstein shocks/struts are under $100 each and easy to find here. Interesting about your friend/mechanic's findings, thanks.

 

To test the strut top mounts you jack up the front end so that the wheel is off the ground, then lift the wheel up and down with a large pole between wheel and ground.
This will show you any play of the top mount.

Paul.

 

Thanks!
How long a pole do you use? I have a three or so foot long piece of pipe that I use as a cheater bar. While the car is in the garage (it's night here) I just jacked one side of the car up until the tire was a couple of inches off the ground and put the pole under it from the side. Started rocking on it, no noise anywhere but from the jack it's sitting on, I don't think the wheel moved, the pole seemed to be squishing the tire and the whole car was moving around until I was concerned I would collapse the jack...

That being said, there is SOME play in the mount, I can see that even when it's on the ground and I bounce the fender hard repeatedly, the shock nut part of the strut moves around minutely. But no noise as obviously all the weight is on the tire and it's all compressed, I can't bounce it hard enough to get it to loosen and clunk. I see how the pole test would perhaps do that but could not get enough force under it to move up from the droop position with what I have handy at the moment.

 

A new wrinkle. I had occasion to go to a junkyard near me and was pleasantly surprised (for my purposes, not in general) to find a Jaguar Sportwagon in the general population. So that's one more of those down for the count. But it allowed me to harvest some bits I needed. It was a 2006 if anyone's keeping count.

Anyway, I inspected the strut towers and realized that (well I realized I could and should have asked any/all of you the same) that there are at least FIVE threads showing in the strut above the center shock nut. On this car they were original, still with factory paint marks on the tower bolts so I'm confident this is how it left the factory.

Upon coming home I realized that I have at most THREE threads showing above my shock nut. This could well be what is going on, assuming of course that my new Bilsteins have the exact same number of threads at the to as the factory ones do or did.

Two Questions:
1. Could someone who has had their shocks replaced with Bilsteins (same as factory), check their strut nuts and tell me how many threads are showing above the nut? (if you don't have a clunking noise)
2. I can't get them any tighter. I've tried torquing them with the allen center using a torque wrench with the Allen socket bit and the 18mm nut with an offset box wrench, no problem going to the torque spec. I can get them a little tighter but not two or three threads worth by hand. I've tried an electric 1/2" impact but it just spins the shaft of course. I then tried it with the nut almost all the way loose to give it a "running start", no difference. Should I jack it up, remove the wheel for access, compress the spring a bit to take the slack load off the shock and hold the shaft to prevent it spinning somehow without marring the shaft and with the Impact?

What suggests you to tighten these down more IF IN FACT it seems that there should be more threads showing.

Thanks!