Hello Jaguar Family,

I have two hopefully quick questions so that I may continue down my troubleshooting path. Today, I discovered two things that have me baffled. Mostly becuase I don’t know what is normal, but this did not seem normal to me.

1. At the battery on the positive terminal is a black connector that has two wires going out in separate directions. One is a red lead and the other is a large round heavy insulated cable - black that disappears under the spare. I don’t have a multi enter, but I do have a test light. When I connect the clip to the red cable and then touch the ground - the light lights up. Continuing I move up and test the nut above the red wire - get the light. Continuing over to the right side of the connector. The top nut righthand side - the light comes on. I move down to the last terminal on that connector. This is the one with the heavy black cable. I get no light. I am not sure if that is not a battery cable and no light is what it should be or is the cable bad. All connections and terminals have been thoroughly cleaned.

2. In trouble shooting my new starter, I wanted to make sure the ground was not causing an issue in any way. So I clipped the red clip on the Starrett terminal that is said to be the constant. I touched the engine ground cable and got nothing. Set it up and video recorded a start attempt. I did it twice and neither time did the light come on. But it should have, correct?

I have followed all the helpful advice on here regarding no crank, no start. Good battery, attempt with second vehicle on jumper cables (2017 F-pace R sport), I have purchased three starters, this most recent one is refurbished from a parts vendor. The others have been preowned from parted vehicles, I replaced key fob battery, I have pulled and checked every fuse and relay that I can get to, I have changed the oil, I can hand crank the engine 9and do regularly), I have cleaned all battery connections and grounds, I try starting it from park and neutral in each series of attempts.

The codes that I seem to only pull now are “ engine failed to start” and ‘invalid data passed from TCM”

I did notice one thing recently that I hadn’t noticed before. The steering wheel is not locking. Not in any state, you can always move the steering wheel. Off, park, iGnition on. Now it
is tough to move when the car is off, but it doesn’t lock like I recall it locking. It did right?

I can’t thank you all enough. I will get this car started again.

Have a great holiday weekend. You know where I will be ….under that Jag.

 

Lots of things must happen, and in the proper sequence, for the X351 to start. Maybe these excerpts from the shop manual can help in your situation.

 

On my 2014 XJR the steering column does not lock.

Can you post any pictures as that will help?

I will guess the wires your seeing are part of the BMS (Battery Monitor System)?
Here is a picture I stole from another thread with the BMS connection circled in red.





As always are you sure the battery is good? Hate to see you do a bunch of stuff if the battery is the problem. Age?
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I was wondering what my plan of attack was going to be tonight. Tonight, I am going to trace the start up process as best I can from your document!

😊Thank You!!!!!

Brett Christiansen

Galveston, TX
2014 Jaguar xjl supercharged v8
2017 Jaguar F Pace R sport dynamic

 

Here are a few pics that may help! Thanks Clubairth1

With cover closed. On positive terminal.

With cover open

Can’t find that LED that is supposed to stay on for three seconds

 

Bit hard to follow your measurements with test light, but on your 2nd pic, where cover is removed: If you don´t get power from point arrows pointing; Note that the black part, with yellow markings MEGA 450A on it, between 2 nuts, is a fuse. If its blown you dont get power on point of arrows pointing.

 

Good question as the manual plainly states that there is a PATS light in the center of the dash but nowhere can I find where that light is?
If you look at all the dash warning lights they don't list a PATS light?

Anybody know where this PATS light is? Suppose to blink when there are problems. My old S-Type had a PATS light in the center of the dash on the defroster duct. My XJ has a similar looking sensor up there but it's listed as a sunlight sensor? I looked at my car and it does not light up either?
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My 2012 does not have a dedicated PATS indicator, either. The Mitchell manual I referenced supposedly covers the 2010-2012 MY. The Owners Manual also does not mention PATS anywhere.
Perhaps in these MYs, a non-communicative PATS sequence would result in the generic Red Triangle warning. In a faulty condition, maybe pressing the "OK" button on the right-side joypad would recall some info, or maybe the triangle itself would emit the blinking codes referenced in the Shop Manual.
In any event, Brett, when you turn the ignition ON, does either the red or yellow triangle blink after 3 seconds?
Curiouser.

 

Brett, I should have searched for the beginning of the related thread where you detailed the overheating, starter, etc. issues you've experienced.
In light of this new (to me) knowledge, I don't think the anti-theft system is the culprit.
You suffered an overheating situation and had a JLR dealer replace coolant pipes, but the car would then not start (at the dealership?!). Did they not provide any additional diagnostic information after you spent thou$and$ of dollars in their shop?
Then you were able to start the car and drive it briefly, and now it's "click, no start". My friends often urge me to "seek professionsl help" I'm afraid you may now be in that position, too. I'll bet you a plate of ribs that a competent Jaguar mechanic with the proper diagnostic hardware and software can pinpoint your problem. We're chasing a lot of different ghosts on this one.

 

Thanks much Baltobernie I thought I was blind!
I did more digging and again your right no mention of PATS in any of the owners manuals I have. BUT it is mentioned in all the service manuals with no further information past the center of the dash location for the flashing light.

Sorry to derail the thread?

BrettInGalveston have you done the test requested up thread by varsara? Hoping this will be a fuse problem but as that is 450A fuse I have a hard time seeing it blow?
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have you tried turning the crankshaft manually

 

Update?

 

@BrettInGalveston You simply cannot guess and shoot in the dark. Doing so can make matters worse by causing electrical shorts that damage modules. It's essential to have a proper Diagnostic Code Reader that will display all the Jaguar trouble codes so you can follow the correct steps to diagnose and fix the problem.

I suggest that you call a competent Jaguar technician.

 

You all were spot on that the 450 Megafuse had blown. Ordered a new one and the starter began cranking again!

I cleaned all the connections, relays and fuses associated with the start sequence - save only the crankshaft position sensor.

I do have a battery question. The battery that is unit was bought at the dealership and put in a month before the event. I keep it charging. If that battery was bad and preventing the start, would bs able to start with a jump. I have tried jumping ( per the service manual) and it acts the same. Crank crank crank catch (starter quits) and dies.

I can hear the fuel pump and smell the gas. Just was curious if a jump start would override the bad battery issue.

I do have a code reader, throwing a few codes that are not consistent. They come and go. I have replaced some sensors but I have owed up on all cleaned connections, verified things are working. But you're right, i should call a competent mechanic. This is my last ditch effidts before donating or parting it.

Oh, I almost forgot to say. The car started after the Megafuse was replaced. Maybe say 6 times. Even traveled out and went 6 miles or so. Then we were back at this been here about a week. Clean if sensors. Checking grounds and connections a few attemps at starting... But duh-duh-dnt duh-duh-dnt, duh-duh-dnt, Catch, die.

Thanks a million! Through it all I am having a good time and learning a lot! Really 100% a day on Knowles base on Jaguar x351!
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Hey good repair but I have think how did that 450 Amp mega fuse blow? That's enough current to weld steel with and something took it out?

It does help to post what codes you can? We don't have much to go on? What reader are you using? With the level of problems your having a code reader would be worth buying?
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Yea the megafuse blowing is a huge red flag. Could be battery > terminals > cable connections > main harness to something smaller connected via aux.
Most of the time this is like a rat chewing your harness. I'm just guessing though, a competent electrical tech should actually diagnose this for you in a meaningful way. It involves visual inspection and electrical testing.