Hello,

I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this, but I need some input.

After receiving the wrong part from rockauto and clearly explaining why it was the wrong part. I arranged a return, which I didn't have to pay for return shipping, I received the same wrong part again. I can arrange for a return for the 2nd incorrect part, but I have to pay for shipping it back, which does not seem right because they advertise the wrong part in their picture, and they sent the wrong part twice, which are both their fault. RockAuto does not have a customer service number to call, but they have an email. It's been 5 business days, and no email back. I've actually sent two emails earlier this week.

This is their policy:


What can I do at this point?
I could always pay for return shipping, but I don't want to pay for their mistake.

 

AZ, what were the parts? and what is the shipping cost(s)?

I ask what the parts were just for my own curiosity, and interest in how/why they had them mis-advertised.

I ask what the shipping costs are to determine how much effort I would put into standing on a principle.


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The part was AirTex AW4124: https://www.rockauto.com/en/parts/ai...ater+pump,2208
The picture for the part is exactly what I wanted: a pump with a white impeller.


The picture below is what I received:



The information link claims the following:

I am unsure of the shipping costs, but I would assume around $10.

If I don't get a response by next week, then my only real option is to just send it back and "hope" they give me a refund. there's not much one can do if there is no customer service department, and no response to my emails.

 

I don't understand why a white impeller is important to you. If you are thinking that a black plastic will fail because the earliest AJ26 pumps had black and failed, you should contact Airtex and explain your concerns to them. They will probably explain that this is this is the best material available and superceeds the white impeller and is not the same as the impellers of 25 years ago.

Rockauto is merely sending what the most recent model available and they do not specify the materials involved.

 

The early black ones where plastic. The one I received is not black plastic from the days of failure. To quote from another thread: "Asking if the airtex has a white plastic impeller, the metal replacements are not the best for a number of reasons, the black impeller is from the failure days, send it back.
I'm running AJ27S pumps, white plastic impeller, one 300k miles, 150k miles and 2k miles

AJ26 1997-99 (US, 98-00) Had failures with the black plastic impeller pump, bits fell off and blocked waterways, causing an over head event leading to valve seat damage, TSB's covered replacement to the later white impeller from the AJ27 engines.

Alloy 'impeller' replacements have little fins that cause cavitation, they're not a fluid dynamically designed replacement, like Jaguar's........[from another user in the same thread]: "The white impellors are the same being used on the latest pumps for X350's
The metal impellor pumps are not the answer and are not as efficient or as well designed as the white plastic impellor pumps.
They seem to suffer from cavitation erosion whereas the white plastic ones don't."

I'm just following advice from anther thread.

Be aware with buy parts that have TSB's and have updated designs...especially from RockAuto.

 

That was exactly my thought as well, RJ237 was just quicker ...

The color of the impellor says nothing, and plastic processing has come 20 years.
There is nooo way Airtex is using the 1998 process by now, so you should be perfectly fine.

F.y.i., I have this exact pump, bought from Rockauto 2 yrs ago, and it works perfectly fine (which, I know, is no answer to your question ).

 

See my post above (#5):
"Alloy 'impeller' replacements have little fins that cause cavitation, they're not a fluid dynamically designed replacement, like Jaguar's"
And
"The white impellors are the same being used on the latest pumps for X350's
The metal impellor pumps are not the answer and are not as efficient or as well designed as the white plastic impellor pumps.
They seem to suffer from cavitation erosion whereas the white plastic ones don't."

 

I can understand your concern about the non-white impeller, possibly indicating that it is a "cheap imposter", but like RJ237 indicates, maybe this is the latest version from AirTex and the worry is for nothing.

I ordered my water[pump from Welsh's Jaguar Parts, and it did have a white impeller (https://www.welshent.com/Water-Pump-P26109.aspx), but I have read that some endorse the later type with a metal impeller, something about more vanes, but whether that is a myth or not, I'm not sure.

Maybe a call to AirTex would reveal more info?
ASC Industries » Single Product - ASC Industries


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Upon researching what AirTex has pictured for the AW4124 pump, it is the same one that I received with the black metal impeller: https://airtexproducts.es/airtex-pro...talog/?lang=en

Why RockAuto decided to picture one with a white impeller, claiming it to be AirTex, is the issue. Also them sending me the same one, and not telling me that AirTex does not manufacture white plastic impeller water pumps is another miscommunication on their part. They clearly did not read my reason for returning the first part, or just ignored it and did not communicate to me the issue. And they do not respond to someone's email in a timely manner should a problem occur.

I do not blame AirText for the problem. And thanks for the link to the real one. I may just order that one.

 

 

Airtex is not going to go to the trouble to cast an inefficient vane design .. not going to happen. I also agree that the current color of any plastic used has no correlation to a pump problem form 20 years ago.

Both of mine have the original pumps. Does anyone know who is making the current OE pump from Jaguar? What type of vanes?

Pumps in closed systems actually only have to create small pressure differences -- they are sucking. There is no head in a closed system when all at the same level. The flow rate is blocked and controlled by the thermostat ...there is no air in the system w/o air producing cavitation would require boiling of the coolant .... look at the design ... water pumps are simple vortex pumps with a very open design .... like hydronic heat.

Install the pump and forget your worries.

 

Black Nylon 66 impellers have not been manufactured for 20 years!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Here is the info from Jaguar.

bob

 

Motorcar man -- do you know who is making the current OE pump ? or do you always go aftermarket?


I remember this situation -- had an early 1998 VDP that required the change .. it was my understanding that Jaguar changed the vane color just so they would not keep getting them back. With the thermostat problem -- coolant change from yellow to orange (or was it blue) ..and then the water pump issue my car had multiple trips and fluid changes. It was all taken care of and the car was totaled. I had kept my 95 X300VDP -- think that was blue coolant. Jaguar did a head gasket -- all the S6's ending up needing one.

 

The biggest problem with RockAuto is that you have to do all your own research on 3rd party or manufacturer websites to confirm which part number you need. I've ordered too many things from them that ultimately don't fit the car I'm working on even though it says it does. AND they have a lot a whole lot more parts that DO fit, if you can search by part number, but that are not listed under the car you are working on.

I've had a range of issues with Airtex products and will from now on sooner buy from a competitor if available, but I will commend their customer service because they were very helpful in getting warranty replacements and finally arranging refunds. If you have an issue with their pump, call Airtex directly and see if they will help. But the picture looks like the same one I bought based on forum recommendations that quickly sprung a leak. The Airtex pump relies on only the gasket for sealing against the block and came with a paper gasket that didn't last but a few months. I took the Airtex off after it sprung a leak while on a trip out of state and replaced it with a different brand that was designed with an o-ring around the impeller housing and came with a metal gasket that had rubberized openings around the water passages like the OEM. So the Airtex part may have a superior impeller, but has an inferior seal design.

 

So far, I've had good fortune with Rock Auto for 'iffy' parts on different brands of cars. I trustingly choosing their best seller(s) as denoted by the heart symbols--favorites of their customers-- again I trust!. For many parts these are the higher priced ones, but, I reason that these may well be popular in spite of price because they usually don't have configuration--form, fit, and performance problems.
Some of these places like Auto Parts Warehouse--who I sometimes like too, eg Akebono--have some other types of parts on which almost all of their entire on-line catalog will fit YOUR car!! WHAT??!!

 

Rockauto being a reseller -- one never knows exactly where the parts are coming from. It's similar to Autohaus -- they started out bringing in OEM parts for german cars but you can buy almost anything now. They are still stocking dealers for some part but stuff for Japanese cars comes out of other warehouses -- sometimes back to Autohaus to be shipped out ... other times direct to consumer.

If you know the actual part number from the manufacturer -- you can often search through Rockauto and find it. This is true when searching for alternators -- or assemblies ... even when trying to get a specific brake pad. If you order through the portal you will get the generic -- if you can get the manufacturers part number --often you can get the actual OE part.

 

I think the last one I bought was a GATES. I remember when Jaguar switched from the plastic housing with the 'O'ring seal to the 'gasket-only' style water pump, the price dropped from around $200 to about $85 at the parts dept.

You can always use the MOTORCRAFT PW448 {#2W938501BB, 2W9Z8501BB}. Probably what Jaguar started using in the mid 2000s.

bob

 

There's been a lot of debate about metal vs plastic (updated) impellers in many other threads, so I do not want to start this debate all over again.
It will basically come down to personal preference, and I prefer the updated white impeller design because it is more efficient (easier to turn and not as heavy), and I've read on other threads that the AirTex pump can leak.

I will not put this in my engine...

I sent RockAuto a thrid email from a different email address and they responded within the same day... Interesting since it's been 5 business days since I've sent the first email. I'll see what they can do about the problem.

 

Not as heavy ??? it's powered by an ICE ?? MB has been using metal ..forever. Actually, I would take a metal (alloy) over a plastic one any day of the week. There is no efficiency problems -- they are all over pumping and need to be slowed down by the thermostat.

I have no idea if they are prone to leak or not -- why did get an Airtex if you did not want an Airtex?

Hay -- it's your car .. so you get to do what you want.

 

What I ment was that metal is heavier than plastic. Thus, the moment of inertia is higher for the metal impeller, requiring more energy from the engine to turn, making it less efficient.

Whether you prefer metal over plastic is your preference. I prefer the updated white impeller design.

I got an AirTex because the picture in RockAuto implied that it had the white impeller. After realizing it is not the correct photo, I arranged a return. Had you read the first few threads, I wouldn't have had to clarify this for you.