Bought a new battery but wonder if my trickle charger is okay for AGM type batteries?
My charger is not a Ctek but similar.
There is a mode with a snow fling and in the manual it says that your supposed to use it when it's very cold but it also says for some type of AGM batteries?

The regular charge mode gives 14.4 v and 3.8 A.
The snow fling mode gives 14.7 v and 3.8 A.

 

Hej Peter,
Easier if you tell us the name of the charger.
If you are only going to tickle charge it doesnt matter.

And why the hell dont you own a CTEK- its one of the only Swedish contributions to automobiles that has succeeded. Lets say it another way, if you owned a CTEK, it would be the ONLY Swedish thing on your car.

 

Tickle charge= maintenance charge?

Ctek was to expensive at the time!:-)

The charger is a Ultimate Speed ULG 3.8 B1.

I also have a Tronic t4x which have the exact same charging modes but delivers 3.6 Amp

 

Yes tickle charge or as the world calls it 'Trickle Charge' is simply small current trickled to the battery.

I do not recommend any of the chargers you have. Sorry they are garbage for AGM.

AGM has a very funny curve. The unit basically has to calculate in a clever way what is the best way to charge it. CTEK has patents on this clever algorithm. So its not just yet another charger. And thats why chosen even by German car manufacturers.

In the long run, for many of your cars, the ctek will actually save you money. By conditioning your batteries properly.

There is no excuse for you to own any other charger.

 

Thanks, I'll have a look at a Ctek but........

Why will the alternator in my car not destroy the battery?
I do find it strange that it is so important with the right charger but a car alternator can charge all type of batteries?

 

Has anyone seen any non-anecdotal data or documentation showing that the alternators in our cars ARE appropriate for AGM batteries? The AGMs have different charge requirements than flooded cells. That is why all the AGM manufactures have special charging requirements for their batteries. The AGM batteries will be damaged when flooded cell charge parameters are used.

If you don't drive your car much it probably does not matter.

 

Its all anecdotal, hypothetical, theoretical and most importantly requiring deduction to derive any meaningful baseline in the Jaguar universe. Here is the proof and point. Regardless of year, model XK/XKR, for no definable reason, some cars had AGM some just SLA. Moreover if the first battery change was done wrong, there really isnt a easy way of finding out what charging system the car was originally supplied with.

I dont believe you can damage an AGM with SLA curve- I think (yes conjecture- anecdotal) you can damage SLA with AGM curve.

 

CTEK is pretty much the long and short of battery chargers... Works brilliantly.

 

I think this Tech bulletin is the result of alternator output (2010 and later), but it doesn't give a "why", just a warning.

 

From batteryuniversity.com
"As with all gelled and sealed units, AGM batteries are sensitive to overcharging. A charge to 2.40V/cell (and higher) is fine; however, the float charge should be reduced to between 2.25 and 2.30V/cell (summer temperatures may require lower voltages). Automotive charging systems for flooded lead acid often have a fixed float voltage setting of 14.40V (2.40V/cell); a direct replacement with a sealed unit could overcharge the battery on a long drive. "

There are other articles that go deeply into the technical details to support their warning on the internet. I am an engineer and believe in science and data, and gather facts to make a decision. Before I make modifications to my cars I want to understand the unintended consequences that could be lurking. If you want to use "anecdotal, hypothetical, theoretical and most importantly requiring deduction to derive any meaningful baseline", its your car. Do what you want.

 

I am with you. I kept my car with its stock AGM battery- despite having a shop full of really amazing lifepo battery systems that we make in-house. Half the weight of reg battery and insane amperage.
What gave you the idea that I am a moder?

You provide valuable information about why OPs cheaper chargers will ruin his AGM battery. But no risk of that with our cars, they dont charge constantly like standard alternators with voltage regulators.

Here is a very good explanation why the right curve makes a difference.
https://www.victronenergy.com/upload...tteries-EN.pdf

 

The OP asked you why the alternator is OK for an AGM and his chargers are not. I agree with his question and asked, "Has anyone seen any non-anecdotal data or documentation showing that the alternators in our cars ARE appropriate for AGM batteries?" I know there are a bunch of people that changed their flooded batteries for AGM batteries and they are happy with the AGMs. Great. Most of them don't drive their cars very often or very far so they will never see an overcharging issue. I drive my cars. A lot. We take long driving trips and I am concerned about over charging an AGM battery as I have not seen anything to indicate that the Jaguar charging system can be properly set up for an AGM.

Hence my question - where is the data or documentation to support use of AGM batteries in our cars? The TSB Sean provided indicates that there were cars built with AGM batteries and they have differences in the charging systems as the battery type should NOT be changed from the OEM installed type. This Jaguar specific document says don't change battery types and is supported by general AGM battery charging and use data found on the internet.

This is good enough for me, without even considering the effect of lower internal resistance of an AGM that results in a higher load, more heat, and shorter alternator life.

Bottom line, I would not replace my flooded batteries with AGMs in any of my cars. I would not recommend that to any of my friends either as I believe there are risks to the battery and alternator if the car was not originally set up for an AGM.

 

I believe it all boils down to the charging system. Up until the 2010 or 5.0L cars the charging system was a dumb type with a set charging voltage. I don't believe there was a variable charging rate similar to the smart charging system used on the 5.0 L cars. Because of this system I suspect the AGM or Flooded batteries are compatible with the later cars and would not pose a problem with daily use.

 

??? Huh ??? You did not read the technical bulletin that Sean posted above. It applies to "MY 2010 Onwards" and says "Vehicle batteries (Absorbed Glass Mat [AGM] or flooded) must be replaced 'like for like'. "

The reason for that is the two batteries have different charge requirements and the charging system cannot determine which one is fitted. The charging system will ONLY charge using the program for which it was originally set - either flooded or AGM.

 

David- you turned me around with "our cars". We dont have the same car as op.
You question about alternators in 'our' cars (5.0) can be easily answered with one more question, are there 2 versions of the alternator for our car? if not, there is your answer.

As to the OP question about why would his cheaper charger damage Agm and not the alternator. Because the alternator does not charge for a week at a time. However, we answered the broader question, just spend $50 bucks.

 

An AGM can take everything any alternator can dish out in terms of max charging rate. Regardless, there is only so much the alternator can put out- the SLA can also take what our alternators put out. The only potential problem, is what you cited, shortening batt life when car goes on long journeys. However an AGM has more life to begin with.

The question we should be asking is why Jag is using both of them. It seems more dangerous what they are doing.

 

"Our cars" are modern V8 Jaguars.

I accept the data and requirements of the battery manufacturers, charger manufacturers, and warnings from auto makers such as Jaguar and Porsche and will avoid changing battery type in my cars. If you still think it is a good idea to change type, go for it.

I am done with this thread.

 

No one here is discussing changing batteries
You may have got on the wrong bus.

 

I'm wondering if the OP's XK-06 can properly charge an AGM. (I suspect not.)

I'm confident a ctek can.

As I understand the charging system in my car (04 STR) it is like the XK-06 and not really suitable for AGM (because it does not use the right voltage/curve, judging by JTIS).

(Caveat: I do not know for sure.)

 

I have had an AGM battery on my 07 XKR for around three years and haven't noticed any issues with charging.