With the F-Type coming out with a 6 Speed 3 peddle transmission would it be possible to retrofit it into an XK. I wonder if it could be bolted up to a 5.0L . Would be an interesting experiment but maybe a little costly.

 

Physically I'm sure it would bolt up. Then dealing with adding another peddle might be doable. Using custom linkages there's a chance you get shifter in the correct location. These are things that a very skilled shop/person can make happen. The real problem comes from getting the ECU and TCU to actually still work without all the electronics from the stock auto sending sensor information.

 

^^^^^^^ What he said. An electronic nightmare.

 

We all know anything can be done with time and money. I'm sure that there are some hardware/software black boxes that could resolve the communications issues. I believe the transmission has it'sown module and communicates with the engine. The manual gearbox also has some electronics which talks to the ECM so there should be a way to link them. I didn't say it would be easy but because I assume Jaguar won't give up the code you'd need to do a little reverse engineering. As for the peddles and mechanisms that's just hardware and would be the easier modifications. Just a little out of the box thinking and maybe some day someone will attempt it.

 

OK so there are a few things to consider here.

Firstly the ZF S6-45 from the manual V6 F-Type will not handle the power of a V8. The S6-45 is only rated to 470Nm, with the 5.0L putting out north of 625Nm, it probably wouldn't last very long, which is one of the reasons why there is no V8 manual with the F-Type.

But, there was a manual version of the S-Type diesel, which used the ZF S6-53 transmission, which is rated to 600Nm.

The bellhousing of the 2.7L diesel is the same as the 4.2L AJV8, and a couple of such conversions have been done in the UK.

I don't know if the bellhousing of the 2.7/4.0/4.2 is the same as the 3.0/5.0, I'm gonna guess that it is, but until someone takes some measurements there is a question mark over this.

Either way you will probably need a custom clutch, and probably a custom flywheel as well. On a 5.0L you might be able to use the F-Type clutch and flywheel, but again it may not be up to the task.

There's no "electronics" in the ZF manual transmission, except for the reverse position switch. No output speed sensor or anything like that. And the clutch pedal has a switch on it.

Adapting the electronic/software side of things might not be so complicated after all. There is an option in the CCF (car configuration file) on these cars for manual transmission. The difficulty might be that the V8 ECM program does not have the functions for the clutch pedal switch in it, and it will need to be re-worked accordingly.

Pedal box could probably be taken from the S-Type as well. Likewise the shifter, shift boot, gear knob, etc. Or from the F-Type. I don't think the floorpan/firewall will be the same between them, but a working pedal box from a related vehicle is a good start.

There might be some issues getting the clutch master cylinder located but it wouldn't be insurmountable.

To handle the power of the 5.0L it might necessary to look outside of ZF for a transmission, the Tremec for example but I don't like the double-overdrive in a manual, 6th gear is a total waste. The ZF's a 5 + 1 overdrive which is nicer IMHO. But if you go looking elsewhere then an adaptor plate will be needed and the driveshaft will need modification as well. The S6-53 is exactly the same length as the 6HP26 and the output flange is the same as well, no no special driveshaft would be needed.

Such a conversion would be in reach, if you had a spare $10-$15k and a lot of patience.

 

Tend to find people will not spend that kind of money or even half that.

It's not DIY unless you're quite a software guy. (If you are, write the software and sell it!)

 

Yep, gotta pay to play.

I actually looked into this conversion for my XJR, purely to do something different.

The difference between brand new and second hand parts (for the standard parts) makes a big difference, but these bits will only be available from the UK or continental Europe. So shipping costs come into play as well.

Here's a secondhand six-speed from a 2.7 S-Type for 430 quid JAGUAR S TYPE6 SPEED MANUAL GEARBOX | eBay

With an X150 it's just a matter of changing some values in the CCF, and maybe changing a few things in the ECU file. We know a guy who can do it, it's probably the easiest part of the conversion. The hardware (esp. the clutch/flywheel) will be more difficult.

 

I saw an XJR (XJ350) converted to a manual at my local indy. It may be cheaper to convert the engine and transmission as one unit from F type into XK.

If the XK was offered in a manual; I'd still own it.

 

Cambo as a little past history I've done a half dozen Jag conversions in my youth. Although it maybe sacrilegious to some these were done with high engine mileage cars. The consisted of Ford drivetrain in XKE , GM transmissions in XJ6 , V8 carb engines in XJ6 and fuel injected engines with 5 speed manuals in XJS (auto box car). I had worked with a few different machine shops and had designed all of the mechanical changes. The difference back then was the amount of electronics was limited to ECM's and in all of the applications I was able to purchase modified off the shelf ECM packages with plug and play wiring harnesses. Now I suspect if one wanted to take a V6 SC with the 6 speed from an F-Type it would be easier then just putting in a 6sp manual on the 5.0L. We have a TV channel over here call Velocity which has various car shows that build or restore cars and have demonstrated creative fabrication techniques in making all kind of conversions work. Far above my skills level but these guys seem to make anything happen at a cost. If i were 20 or 30 years younger and had some extra cash I would look at this as a fun and challenging project. At this point in my life it is just a sky blue thought to stimulate my brain. Now if one wanted to stick a C7 Corvette drive train into a late model XKR it would probably be easier but would miss my objective. Just a brain fart here but fun to discuss. Thanks for your thoughts.

 

I'm appreciating this thread and am impressed with the level of experience and knowledge shown in the posts. Also, I love the thought experiments! So here's my question: what is the possibility of dropping the F-type's 8 speed ZF into a late model XKR? I realize that given enough cash anything can be done, but from an engineering/electronics POV, do-able?

 

Do you think you could get some more info on that XJR that converted to a manual?

 

That would be in the way-too-hard basket from my point of view. Easier to just buy the F-Type with the manual box. Unless you went to a complete standalone engine management system, but then you would have problems keeping the rest of the cars systems functional.

There are some off-the-shelf kits to do pretty much this, but for the X100 XK/R. I don't know of anyone who's done it with the X150 yet, they are still too new and valuable for people to be going down that road, but give it time.

I'd say pretty close to zero. The 8-speed cars run a Bosch ECU, the 6-speed (autos) a Denso, and i doubt very much that the TCM from an 8-speed will work with the ECU from a 6-speed. It's not just the TCM and ECU, the instrument cluster is also in the party, and the body control module as well.

From a mechanical point of view, it should just slip straight in. Although the diff ratio from the 6-speed car may not work very well with the 8-speed.

Another one in the way-too-hard basket from my point of view.

 

Thanks Cambo. That was my suspicion, I guess I'll manage with just 6 speeds...

 

As I recall, it was/is available, just not from Jaguar themselves.

Not cheap.

 

The shop says the owner bought it that way from a car auction. That part is working (transmission part), but the rest of the car needs a lot of TLC. They did not have any other info on the car.