Hi,

I've currently going through a dispute with the local dealship after the engine on may 2007 XKR had to be rebuilt following a mis diagnosis by them. The courts have asked for the expected life or amount of kilometers the engine would be expected to completed before it would have otherwised need a rebuilt or reconditioning. The engine had 130k on the clock at the time of the mis diagnosis.

Can anyone advise if they have any data on this or point me in the direction of an expert in this field.

Many thanks.

Colt.

 

I don't think there's enough time elapsed on this engine series to know the average overhaul life.

130K KMs is not even at half life.

 

What the hell is a kilometer?

I would run your question past Jaguar, but you might want to avoid mentioning you're involved in a suit with one of their dealerships.

 

I'm with Mikey, 130k km is nothing for our engines. I expect they'll do at least the double if you service the engine as should.:-)

 

Before we delve into this matter perhaps we should have an understanding of exactly what went wrong with the engine

Was it a blown head gasket, warped block, valve issues ????

Lastly was the maintenance schedule up to date

 

130,000 km is appropriately 80,800 miles. That's not excessive, unless it was driven only on Sundays by a little old lady 1/4 mile at a time!

 

I think you are going to have trouble finding a published accurate number for the life expectancy of a Jaguar motor. I researched that awhile ago to support a valuation on a XJS that someone totaled for me. The best I was able to do was generalizations of life expectancy of "modern cars". One hundred fifty thousand to 200,000 miles and ten years seemed to be general expectations that I found published. See below. Most cars fall off the road for reasons other than extreme engine mileage so I question the numbers I found.

I assume they want you to pay part of the engine rebuild cost as they want to show that it should extend the life and value of the car. This is probably not the case as other items will take the car off the road before the engine wears out. Probably the transmission, electrical stuff, suspension, or the interior/exterior just get too old, worn out and ugly to make it worth keeping.

It is a tough argument. I had trouble showing that my 26 year old XJS was worth much more than scrap metal.

https://www.cardealpage.com/column14.html
How long will my car last? - Business - Consumer news - ConsumerMan | NBC News

 

I don't think you'll find a specification for the engine anywhere. I'd think the ring package would be the limiting factor. Once the spring tension starts to go it'll get blow by and start pumping oil through the air stream. Otherwise there's not much to go wrong as long as the lube works correctly. We've seen that if you heat cycle the coolant parts enough they'll fail but that's almost maintenance like belting and hoses.

I'm at 125k miles with no issues other than wear / tear, mostly by the PO. I think the hybrid 8" Ford rear is the weak link in the early cars and maybe bushings if you let the shops talk you into replacing them for cracks in the rubber.

 

I believe the answer or precedence a court would be looking for is rather simple to find.
All you have to do is go through the classifieds and show them the umpteen Range Rovers with this engine that have happily done twice the mileage.

You also have some other empirical data, show them that on the 100,000 mile service Jaguar does not recommend rebuilding the engine.

 

There are two other significant pieces of facts.
There is a 75000 mile service schedule suggested by Jaguar. I am assuming it could be argued why would Jaguar have you do maintenance on an engine that will be rebuilt just 5000 miles later.

You can also get testimonials from Range Rover forum members who have done twice the miles.

BTW, I helped another kiwi on this forum with a predatory dealer, it makes me believe Jaguar dealership in NZ means a Jaguar the predator.

 

The 4.2L engine has been around since 2003, so there is plenty of data regarding its longevity. I have not had a 4.2L Jaguar but I do have its 4.0L predecessor on my 2002 XKR, and it has over 165,000 miles on it, without an engine or a tranny rebuild. 80,000 miles is not very much mileage for modern day engines. What was the misdiagnosis?

 

my 2007 XK coupe has 166k miles on it
tysts over 240k kilometers and it's still going strong

jaguar improved significantly since 2007 with German
ZF transmission
it's much more solid handling and feeling than pre 2007

its common knowledge that XJS v 12 was a nightmare

also JDW reports jag very highly

 

???

Except in the supercharged cars, Jaguar used the ZF transmissions from the beginning of the XK8 series.

They used a Mercedes transmission in the supercharged cars which was MUCH more robust and problem free than the German ZF transmission.

 

+1 and has nothing top do with the OP's question.

 

Not all of us have trouble staying on.....LOOK A SQUIRREL!

 

I don't think forum anecdotes would be useful as evidence in a court case.

I suggest citing "Vehicle Lifetime Trends and Scrappage Behavior in the U.S. Used Car Market"

Average life of a passenger car in US is 15.6 years, with EPA reporting 15K miles/year in US. You can conclude that you expected your engine to last more than 234,000 miles or 376 500 km.

 

Nobody uses an industry average for something that can vary so dramatically- and thats why there are none- thats why he is struggling.
Besides the question is not how long a car lasts- its when is an engine rebuild is recommended (not due).
Those are 2 very different things.
As noted earlier. Jaguar has a 70,000 service recommendation, which is the closest mark to his mileage, they may even have a 100,000 service recommendation. If it does not have rebuild the engine as a schedule and has something to the contrary, thats the best evidence, as it comes from those who know the car well. I further suggested that he look at the Ranger Rovers folks who use this exact engine.

 

Just tell them 300K miles

 

I would expect that any engine that has had regular & proper maintenance would be able to join the "Million-Mile" club, if driven in the manner it was designed for, as a passenger street vehicle.

 

The 2007 is I suppose a 4.2 (NA or SC - essentially the same as in my STR) and jag provide service/maintenance sheets etc. I see nothing about a rebuild up to the 150K miles it covers. (It can be interpreted to go further perhaps?)

Here's something like the "right" one