Hello all again. I decided I'd just own up to my .. ahh.. brave attempt at getting a known flood car restored. Quick recap before I enthrall you with the events of the evening. Only known water "issues" are the headlights, fog lights, and a completely packed engine. (coil packs/plugs were in a water bath). No other areas, filters, fuses, interior, trunk etc with any signs of water damage.

So tonight, finished pulling the coil packs while the daughter Leah (14 years old) played with the OHM meter. She was a trooper, and was having fun. I printed the manuals from the links you all showed me, put them tablet style in a three ring binder. Leah then proceeded around the car, pulling every fuse, cleaning with a light sandpaper and contact cleaner, testing, documenting and then reinstalling. Was a joy just to spend a few hours with her. Almost makes the project completely worthwhile just to have some fun together.

Ok, so the driver side bank was "cleaner" then the passenger. A bit more oil in the water on that side that keep the coils from rusting the way the passenger side is. (at some point, i'll have to post some progress pics). so with the plugs removed, and the wrong depth 24mm socket on a 1/2 inch drive (12 inch long)... time to remove the hood and get to the crackshaft. (couldn't find my deepwell, and an extension pushed the wrench into the fans.) but, got it on enough to prove the engine is free. I wouldn't say it spins easy, but I couldn't get the right leverage, and I have no idea how many pounds or torque it should require to turn over a XKR. So bad hand position, short wrench, wrong socket, some force.

I cheated at work today. (shhh) and spent some time reading the forums. I would LOVE some opinions on the following course of action.

My thought would be to grab my flexible bore scope and see what the piston walls look like. With luck, there will be no, or only very minor scoring from the water issue. If that is the case, then remove the valve covers, inspect that area and change the secondary tensioners if they haven't been converted already. (likely not) If nothing pops out that screams "tear the sucker down completely", then I'm going to be tempted to reassemble and see if I can get it running. Major scoring, or valves obviously rusting away would force a different course of action. hopefully the scope will show me enough to make that determination.

Thoughts? (oh, and a BIG thanks to all who have been following and helping with the suggestions. Much Much Much appreciated)


(follow this link https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...-begin-195503/ to Part 1 - GGG)

 

I would have continued the original thread instead of starting a new one so I've added a link to it at the end of your post #1.

You're making good progress and certainly a lot easier to do all the electrical checks with two pairs of hands.

Graham

 

Before starting it up, I would check the supercharger oil and the transmission. The few folks that have done these flood restoration/barn find cars have posted about transmission oil compromised with water...

Not sure it matters in the end, but have you worked out a "scenario" as to what happened? Was this car flooded while parked in a garage? Or was it flooded when the previous owner ran into water too deep? From what you are saying there is no evidence of water in the intake (good!), but at the same time there is water in the plug wells (high up) but somehow the rest is fairly clean? Just curious, really.

 

Jared,
Since I'm in Houston, I was wondering where you found the XKR? Also curious, like fmetz as to the story of the Flooded Car.....It's amazing how many stories I've heard of where the Car was, How they got there.....on and on......

Billy Clyde in Houston

 

Personally before going through pulling the valve covers I'd change the oil in the engine and supercharger, pull the plugs and put a teaspoon or so of oil in each cylinder. Turn the car over enough to get the oil pressure up a little. Drain the oil and if all looks good put it back together and try starting it. Do not run it through the gears until you also drop the transmission pan and replace with new trans oil and filter/pan.

There's a dead/ kill switch on the left side under the cover where the hood release is, be sure it is reset first.

After getting the engine running and cleaning the trans I'd also flush the diff oil before driving much.

After all this you will have a better idea of what works and then go into the timing chain guilds, etc.

Just my 2 cents.

 

I'm assuming your talking about the inertia switch? I'm unaware of any other kill switch.

Sooooo.. yesterdays finds. (mind you, I love this car..)

Rick and Randy got a chance to come over, (Rick was in Florida since it was delivered, Randy was working to hard... he says). Anyway. R and R are VERY solid wrench turners, they aren't afraid to tear anything apart. (and Randy has a lift at his place and a pretty nice workshop/garage). So after declining a few immediate offers for my new ride, and once Randy stopped drooling we got a bit more serious. We used the flex camera (borescope) on all 8 cylinders with mixed results. Mixed in the sense that we really couldn't get a good clean pictures of the cylinder walls, but what we could see, (carbon build up on the piston heads, shiny walls when we could get a good view) didn't cause us any real concern. We followed that with a bit of a debate on Diesel vs Oil through the spark plugs to coat, break up, add lubrication. (my car, I eventually decided 5W30). I had the engine draining for the past three days, so buttoned it up, added 5.5 quarts through the Oil fill, and went more than a tablespoon into each cylinder. (split up the 1/2 quart between them). And yes, I know it's a 7 qt system, but the goal is simply to get it turning over, then change the oil again. so I don't think a quart low is a big deal at this point. Our goal was to get the starter engaged (plugs out) simply to get the oil pump running and possibly test coil packs/plugs. Even with an extra battery tethered to the 2013 Jaguar stickered unit in the trunk (and on a trickle charger the last 3 days), we couldn't get the starter to engage, Loud clicking, very little amp draw on the battery. So... that puts me in a position to pull/rebuild the starter. Were it easy to remove... I'm confident on my ability to get a DC motor running. (I used to own a slot car raceway/business in Anchorage Alaska and hand built electric motors). But, as you all know the joy of getting the starter out, and the lovely steering system in they way...... might have to wait until we can trailer it down to Randy's lift. I'm not sure I want to attempt to jack the front end that high, and crawl under that limited space. (again.. i'm an 'average' (cough) guy)

We hand cranked the engine through 3-4 complete cycles, listening for any sounds that would scare us coming through the spark plug holes (none). I also pulled the supercharger fill plug and extracted half a thimble of clear (and very smelly) supercharger oil. I don't see a need to attempt the SC oil change yet.

On the positive, when we trailer the lady down to work on the starter, we'll drop the tranny pan and do a system flush, and see what if any contamination we find there. We also dropped the top in manual mode, tested the horn, wiper wash motor and a few other stray components that I hadn't gotten to yet.

There is also the possibility that I tracked down the owner of the car when the Texas floods happened. I've made contact with her office and sent some pictures and my information request. Waiting to hear back.

On the negative, and the two steps back part of my night.... After R and R left, I conditioned the leather and started trying to figure out the seat module removal, (since I have no functions on either electric seat, just clicking). Of course the seats are most of the way forward with just enough space (passenger side) for my head, small trouble light and my right arm. The upside down orientation didn't help a whole lot until about the 10th time I reviewed these forums and the pictures provided to understand what I was doing. The module was removed and opened. (pics included) I'm going to clean both boards (drivers side too) and hope I can get some functionality running. I'll also attempt to use a 12v battery directly on the front back motor leads to unbolt the seat.

Of course, the new "evidence" of water damage did drop my spirits a bit, (and pissed me off, since there was no water line marked on this car). as with the wet coil packs and seat mods obviously wet it is harder to understand how much water this car was in. (the Radio only displays the lcd light, blower motor works). In contrast to the obvious wet evidence is the dry air filter, air box, mass air flow sensor area, fuse panels, trunk etc.

So before the flame war happens and "you bought a known flood car, what did you expect?" arguments begin, let me explain a bit. I likely reviewed 2000+ flood cars from Texas at the various auction sites. I tracked almost every 2 door rear wheel drive coupe or convertible across Mercedes, BMW, Hyundai, Jag, Porsche etc. I also really like the Audi/VW line so many of those ended up on my watch list. Almost all the flood cars had or have a yellow line to indicate the water level and water evidence to match. This did not. and while the car was listed as possibly being "enhanced" (ie co-parts "could" clean it to maximize its value) with the amount of cars Houston had to deal with it is difficult to believe they would attempt to get max value from a 2000 vs all the 2015-2017 cars they had to deal with. Likely it came to them in this condition. A water line mark would have changed my perception (and bid price) vs the nearly perfect interior shown (and delivered) which causes one to assume it wasn't submerged wet.

So "buyer beware" - I guess. someone cleaned it up, but didn't drain the oil, and didn't want the buyer to know how much water it was in, hopefully the old owner can give me some insight. I have no regrets with the purchase, the car is nearly perfect, as is the interior. This just changes the amount of dismantling I might 'get' to do, and the costs to get her back on her paws again.

hmmm maybe I need to find a wreaked parts car. seat mods, radio, passenger door speaker, spare relays, wiring harness, alternator.. (which will need to be tested) spare starter, BCM, etc etc etc..

This cat WILL roar again!!!

 

I would say try and figure out the level of that water line as a first priority.

Maybe remove one of the door panels. Or pull the rear seats. Check if the control modules in the trunk have evidence of water. The seat covers can be freed from the bottom and rolled up (the foam might show a water line). There is little doubt at this point the car was "detailed" after the flood as an attempt to save it. Water in the plug wells could be from a pressure washer, does not mean the water was ever that high, especially if that water was clean. High enough to flood the seat modules, though. Pull the carpet. FWIW, find the infamous mold thread that was going on up to a few weeks ago. Once mold is in, it seems HARD to get out. Once you get more evidence of that water line, you get get a more informed path forward.

Best of luck, keep us posted.

 

Jared,
Your picture shows the classic effects of water and live electronics mixing.

The corrosion is caused more by the units being powered at the time of immersion rather than the water presence alone.
In some cases, they can be recovered by soaking in clean hot water and scrubbing gently with a toothbrush, then setting them aside in a warm place for several days to dry out completely.

Unfortunately, that seat module is probably destined for the junk pile as it looks to be badly affected - particularly as there are also enclosed relays involved which will be difficult to recover successfully.

I'd recommed disconnecting the battery asap to prevent further rot until you can remove and inspect all the modules for water ingress.

Hopefully as the seat modules are low in the car you may be lucky, but do expect to have more of this type of damage.

Best of luck:- this will be a story to watch

Mike

 

Jared,

If you can find out the License Plate number, the VIN which I know you have and/or the Previous Owner's address or Name...I have a computer program that will tell me who the owner was, the address, License Plate Number....you name it and if that person is in Houston or nearby, I will make contact for you and get the full story.....Just let me know if you have any of this info.....

Billy Clyde in Houston

 

Billy, I found a Car check tag in the center and have made contact with her "office". I have yet to hear back from them.

As far as Michaelh and fmertz and the overall water issue (and live electronics)... well.. I believe I have my "how deep" answer. (and of course i'll include a pic). Specifically to Michaelh, I agree with your "not wet long, but hot" assessment. I work in Telecommunications, (Your local phone, catv and internet provider.. call me today for a GREAT deal!) and have seen more than my share of wet electronics.

I didn't get a lot accomplished tonight. I cleaned both power seat modules with No-conductive contact cleaner and a soft bristle toothbrush, (getting the drivers side out wasn't exactly fun). they looked almost identical. ie.. both not pretty.. So contact cleaner having a high evaporation rate, I let them sit for 20 minutes and tried both on the passenger side where the cables are a WEE bit longer. The various relays fire on both boards exactly the same, but no movement. With the seat in the car, almost impossible to put a meter on the back side of the module to see if any voltage is coming out of the board. That of course leads me to my bigger problem.... how do get the seat to adjust back and forth to remove them. because of course... they are covering all 4 of the hex screws on both sides. I'm going to try to put battery lead on what I think is the forward back cable and pray it moves...(if anyone has a trick for manually moving those seats,, PLEASE let me know)

I have reason to suspect, now, that all the seat motors were submerged.. I used my bore camera up inside a door panel. nothing to see there. (the passenger side speaker is missing, although I have the cover. so easy access atm). And the power windows work, However, (and not sure why I didn't really look into the glove box before.. but)... the glove box liner (pic below) is what I have to reasonably believe was the water line.. and yes.. in some ways.. I do have the knot in the pit of my stomach over this...... If that is the line.. that is over the J-gate, over the radio. (which lights but doesn't work) to the bottom or a wee bit higher into the hvac controls. (blower moter works.). Of course, there is a host of electronics behind the dash that are going to be entertaining (at best) to check out. So, for the engine bay, that would put water below the ECM, just about the level of the front shock towers. (eyeball measurement). and likely right at, or below the coil pack cover. (which of course was fully saturated, and as mentioned, could have been from a power washer.

As much as I hate the fact they did it.. whoever detailed this car did one HELL of a job.. would love to hire them to clean my other vehicles.... that being said.. if the car had been marked that high with water.. I would have passed..

So, why the power washer reference above? well my new friends...our lovely Jaguar got power washed inside the ECM/Transmission control compartment. How do I know this? well, I started pulling relays, looking for corrosion. Nothing at all on the relays and/or fuses to the front bumper side of the emc transmission control housing. and I found it odd that one hex screw was missing from that "sealed" cover, so, being the curious rat that I am. I opened her up... pulled the transmission control module.. and was rewarded with a solid stream of clean, no scent, no debris, no mud, ..... water.... This would have been 8-10 inches higher then the glove box line. I did pull the transmission module apart.. and ohhhhh yea... that has been sitting in water.. long enough that two capacitors fell off. I did pop the cover off the ECM, (oh no,, I voided the warranty!) and that (thankfully) looks good.

Sooooo.. found a pair of seat modules, and the transmission module tonight and they are on they way. Hopefully, i'm done finding "bad news".. but I have NO idea what I might find when I pull the radio out.... that might be my next "project". Randy has his lift/garage booked this weekend, so the earliest we can get working on the starter, turn over the engine will be Feb 3rd.

I appreciate all the help, warm thoughts, and even the rolling eyes. With this latest "news" the thought/doubt that I might be over my head, (pun intended) has started to creep into the edges of my optimism. Way to soon to give up on such a beautiful ride. Hopefully the seat control mods will bring those back to life and the seat motors aren't frozen. I could use a hint of good news!.

Peace!

 

Tossed and turned for an hour or so after going to bed. Things (many) don't add up. Starting with - the transmission module's only opening faces UP... and would have been much higher then the "water line" in the glove box. Thus, if I'm right and someone with a pressure washer flooded that area, then where does that fan at the firewall (behind the ECM) lead? (Ok... in truth I have to give my wife a TON of credit for this idea, and the mouse that would leave her "treats" in her Camry glove box)

Did Mr aggressive power washer flood that compartment enough to back feed water through that fan, and "fill" the glove box? It seems at least plausible.

And for any Harry Chapin fans out there.. Yes, my wife is my 'shooting star'.

Might be time to pull the back seats and check there...Peace!

 

Another area unlikely to be disturbed is underneath the wheel well liners. Might be a water line there, possibly.

Have you checked the CD player/Navigation system? If there was water, it is unlikely to work. If not, could be another data point...

 

Evening all from Iowa.

I had some family time tonight, so only spent a hour or so working through the wet cat. My two goals were to figure out the front back motor plug for the power seats, and get the back seat removed. I got one done. (power seats are forward and down, such a joy with blood rushing to my head. However. I do think i'm closer after seeing Post 8 from https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...xtracts-55313/ I think in my 1.5 inch gap I can see the black plug... now to try to retrieve it!. (ok.. tomorrow night after the blood goes back to my feet)

Back seats were surprisingly easy, again a forum post was a tremendous help. Not a whole lot to report there. (pics below). the seat bottoms were wet, as is the foam pad covering the metal. however, I also know the back quarter windows were down on the car during it's storage months. I have NO idea how much rain that area got after the car went into storage, but it is plausible that the dampness there could be from post flood rains. the rear seat belts are clean all the way through their extraction, so on water was in the retraction assembly. No real line across the seat backing either. I've also added a picture of the trunk. (carpets all removed.) To your question, point about the CD. I can't get the radio powered, and the green eject button didn't do much to push out the carrier. Since I need to replace the radio anyway.. i'll likely yank it out. the amp above the CD holder looks good. There is some light discoloration on a few wires in the trunk fuse box, relays were pulled and inspected, and the fuse cover (and the jack/tools etc) were missing on delivery. so again.. possible some post flood water damage. I did notice some module under the fuse box. so also now on my list is getting access to that for a full inspection..

Peace!

 

Odd, that looks really clean. Any chance it was parked on a sloop and the front was in the water?
Still watching the fun, good luck.

Wayne

 

It is something i've considered. The headlights/fog lights had water. (could have been on a slope). headlights could have been intentionally flooded as well. I haven't snaked my borescope up into either front fender. easy to do with the lamp access.. that might show me something of a water line in the front fenders. Something new to add to the mystery.

the Houston flood event was both rain, and the rivers overflowing. So it's also possible that where this car was located wasn't flooded from the river, but rather from a rather clean source of rain water and was removed/retrieved before any real mud/debris got into it. That could also complicate finding the water line.

 

The cowl under the steering column is super easy to remove (2 screws at the bottom) and would give you access to a whole vertical cross section of the steering column.

You can also check through the center dash vent. The wood veneer pops off. 2 screws to remove a plastic grille, then you should see the face flap. If you open that, you should see the heater core. A mechanics mirror would help, but a borescope is even better. You can check through the left and right dash vents for evidence of water. Same for the foot-well vents.

Just my thoughts.

 

I'm sure you've all missed my daily drivel, so I apologize for being quiet for a day. fmertz. the steering column didn't come off as easy as you suggest. Two screws are removed, but it appears to be held fast about an inch up from the screws. I have the workshop manual, but I tabled that exploration for another day.

So a couple of updates. I received a replacement Transmission mod, and one of the two seat modules I ordered. Being somewhat excited I plugged it into the passenger side to get more relays clicking, but none of the three motors engaging. While I didn't slot it into the Drivers side, I'm betting i'd get the same results. So, thinking critically, it seems unreasonable that three modules would act in the same way. (two of them tested on both seats). Certain relays fire, nothing happens. It also appears from the wiring diagram that the module isn't connected directly to the motors, but back into the harness. (central control module?)

Since I had noticed some discoloration in the "luggage compartment fuse box". I took that apart and low and behold.. yea.. lets just say a replacement is on its way (pic below). Also while I was there I unmounted the suspension module and while it was.. ok... I found a reasonable one and ordered that too. (and the dash was giving me the "incorrect suspension part fitted" error) hopefully all the mods get here before Sat when we are going to tackle the starter and see if we can get any ignition. Also with the new CCM I'm hoping for a new result with the power seats.

Also spent some time with Rick and Randy replacing the front end of a G6. Radiator clips for that car are a pain!

Peace!

 

I love that you are trying to save this car and I wish you well.

At some point, we may have an intervention though

Best.

 

You ar probably looking at the black plastic steering column cowl. I have never worked on it, but I believe it is harder to remove. The wheel might have to comes off for this.

I was talking about the knee bolster/underscuttle. This is a leather-covers part, fairly big, that houses these small vents as well as the Valet button. 2 screws at the bottom (near the pedals), then gently pry it off towards the rear seats (there are 2 pegs on top that pull out). Once popped off, disconnect the 2 connectors (valet and aspirator). Should give you plenty of access to the entire column and a nice vertical span to hunt for a water line.

For your seat controllers, keep in mind these are notoriously prone to failure even when dry. There are many posts about them. The circuit board rubs on the hard plastic case and the electric tracks break, leaving you with no control over some of the movements or heat.

 

Thanks for documenting your journey. Channeling whatever positive psychic energy I can towards you! Hats off to the Brave.