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Spark issue, home on a tilt tray.

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Old 10-16-2017, 03:50 AM
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Default Spark issue, home on a tilt tray.




After leaving Fireball parked up while we were on holiday I took her out for a drive, but she didn't want to go home.
I had been out for a couple of short trips this morning and all was good. Third time out I drove about 10 km then stalled on an off ramp doing about 60 kph.

Fired back up then just ran rough and stalled again, no go after that. Called a tow truck because rain was too heavy to be playing around in a traffic lane.

Got her off the truck at home and fired up straight away, but died under load. Left it about 1/2 hour and started like normal, drove about 100 metres and did U turn and drove back to my drive where she died again.

Series 3 electronic ignition fitted.

Fuel pumps are working, strong yellow spark from what I can see from coil to dizzy(earthing to manifold stud), but no spark at end of plug leads. So spark going into dizzy but not back out again, rotor tested fine.
There is a pulse coming from the coil with a test light. Does that mean the ignition module appears to be ok?

If it is the dizzy cap or module, do you have part numbers in your head Grant? It is the screw on type, not the clip on type. Part number I have for dizzy is 45DM6(is what I wrote in my book when fitting the dizzy, I must have read it off the dizzy.) It came from Jagdaim labelled "Used S3 IGN Kit"

Dr Phill is coming to check it out tomorrow.

Last edited by o1xjr; 10-16-2017 at 03:53 AM.
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Old 10-16-2017, 03:59 AM
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Still think itís related to moisture inside cap from water pump repair. Has just chosen a wet day to rear itís ugly head.
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Old 10-16-2017, 04:35 AM
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Hi Clarke,

I had a no start earlier this afternoon after some short trips.

Outside temp got to 28c in Melb!!

Engine cranked and caught but would die quickly and not run on.

I considered vapour lock, but turning igniton with selector in Reverse didn't fix it.

I popped the bonnet and let hot air out for 10 mins then retried to better effect. Got to where I was going, but it did dent my confidence for a bit.

Probably not the same issue as you, but you mentioned rough running? Dirty fuel?

Is the rotor arm clean?

Apart from the rain, was it humid and warm?

Dissy cap screw on blue is #JLM9528 although a newer # is AEU1502

Hope you get to the bottom of your issue quickly.

Cheers,

Nigel
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Old 10-16-2017, 04:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jag-o-nomic View Post
I considered vapour lock, but turning igniton with selector in Reverse didn't fix it.

Got to where I was going, but it did dent my confidence for a bit.

Probably not the same issue as you, but you mentioned rough running? Dirty fuel?

Is the rotor arm clean?



Dissy cap screw on blue is #JLM9528 although a newer # is AEU1502

Hope you get to the bottom of your issue quickly.

Cheers,

Nigel
Hi Nigel, No vapour lock. I have carby's on my S3 engine.

As for confidence in it, if It fired right now I would drive it to Melbourne without batting an eye lid.

Thanks for the part numbers, just thinking ahead there to save searching for them before I go looking for them if needed. Numbers now written in my big blue book of info.

Spark issue, home on a tilt tray.-dsc_0970.jpgSpark issue, home on a tilt tray.-dsc_0971.jpg

Last edited by o1xjr; 10-16-2017 at 05:26 AM.
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Old 10-16-2017, 07:39 AM
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That sucks.

Clearly Fireball wanted to go to Fiji, and you said NO, ha.

The cap is GL838
Rotor is GL803.

The carbon brush and spring is a Holden Part, and I cannot find the number at the moment, it will be somewhere.

I reckon moisture also, BUT that carbon brush can go AWOL, mostly the 12 not the 6, but stuff happens sometimes.

The fact you have spark, indicates the module is doing its thing, but that coil lead spark should be a Blue cracker, maybe the coil is iffy????

I use Fuelmiser CC215 for them and the 12.
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Old 10-16-2017, 09:04 AM
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Hi Clarke & Grant.

I know I'm coming at this late, but the instant I read your comment of a "strong yellow spark", I also smelled trouble. As Grant says, this should be have a definite blue quality and have a real "crack" to it. Were this an original XK ignition, I would go straight for the dizzy's condenser (capacitor) but on the Series3 system, it's logical to suspect the coil, as Grant suggests.

If you are unsure of moisture inside (or over the outside!) dizzy cap, you could try applying some warm air (not hot) from a heat gun or some "moisture eater" in a can.

If it's now all working fine, try using water in a spray atomiser over coil, then cap, to see if either provokes reappearance of the failure . . . at least then you know where to focus.

Best wishes Clarke and keep us posted,

Ken
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Old 10-16-2017, 01:11 PM
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My post got lost. But, the same points made elsewhere and better. So, no loss !!


Rough point. Unwanted moisture in a cracked cap. Wimp spark.


Carl
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Old 10-16-2017, 04:38 PM
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Thanks for the input guys, we will be looking at it later today.

Grant, from what I have googled the GL part numbers are for a Bosch Distributor with a clip on cap.

Spark issue, home on a tilt tray.-bosch-gasoline-f005x04662-1.jpg

I have a Lucas 45DM6 distributor, it looks like there are three part numbers for that cap
JLM9528, AEU1502 & DDB152, googled them all and they look like mine.

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Last edited by o1xjr; 10-16-2017 at 05:16 PM.
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Old 10-16-2017, 05:34 PM
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Best wishes mate. Dr Phil coming over? Quick . . . hide the grog!!!
Sounds like a fun night in the man cave. Wish I was there.

Cheers,

Ken
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Old 10-16-2017, 08:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by o1xjr View Post
Thanks for the input guys, we will be looking at it later today.

Grant, from what I have googled the GL part numbers are for a Bosch Distributor with a clip on cap.

Attachment 204302

I have a Lucas 45DM6 distributor, it looks like there are three part numbers for that cap
JLM9528, AEU1502 & DDB152, googled them all and they look like mine.

Attachment 204303
OK, my OLD Bosch catalogue states that cap number for the "screw on" cap, XJ6 1979 to 1986, and the picture they provide in the back is vague at best.

My other cats dont even show a number for the S3, just a blank, so maybe Bosch are wrong, AGAIN.

The "GL" is for Lucas, as in GB is Bosch, GD is Denso etc etc.

Go with your snaps/google, it will be safer.
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Old 10-16-2017, 09:20 PM
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Jagdaim have them in stock if I need one, should know more after some testing later today.

Grant, pic below of the GL838

Spark issue, home on a tilt tray.-capture.jpg

Last edited by o1xjr; 10-17-2017 at 03:26 AM.
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Old 10-17-2017, 02:09 AM
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Um Clarke,

That one you have highlighted from Jagdaim is the black clip on.

You can tell by the shape of the collar on the left hand side. That raised ridge is where the clip clicks in.

Just saying...

Cheers,

Nigel
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Old 10-17-2017, 02:11 AM
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I forgot

Jag Part number for the black clip on is #JLM9526

<#JLM9528 is blue screw in>
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Old 10-17-2017, 03:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jag-o-nomic View Post
Um Clarke,

That one you have highlighted from Jagdaim is the black clip on.

You can tell by the shape of the collar on the left hand side. That raised ridge is where the clip clicks in.

Just saying...

Cheers,

Nigel
Just edited that post, it was to show Grant a pic of the GL838. Didn't word that well, Thanks.
The one Jagdaim have is the blue screw on type.

Last edited by o1xjr; 10-17-2017 at 03:40 AM.
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Old 10-17-2017, 03:37 AM
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Default Problem solved

Dr Phill and his diagnostic skills to the rescue. I had a weak spark at the plugs but making the leads fit cap a bit tighter sorted that. But still no go.

It turned out to be no power to the fuel pumps, but when I checked that yesterday I was sure I could hear them running.
Anyway, Phill jumped the pump from the battery and and we got the car up the drive out of the rain to find the problem.

Phill traced it back to the changeover switch in the dash, so we popped it out and swapped for the one from my spare instrument panel. All good.

So I now have all the part numbers on hand if I do run into an ignition problem in the future.
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Old 10-17-2017, 04:24 AM
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Great news Clarke and thanks for the update mate.

That's fairly naughty of Miss Fireball, throwing 2 apparently unrelated faults together - weak spark and no fuel. With both all sorted, she will reward you with far more grace and pace for her given space.

Cheers and best wishes,

Ken
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Old 10-17-2017, 04:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by o1xjr View Post
Jagdaim have them in stock if I need one, should know more after some testing later today.

Grant, pic below of the GL838

Attachment 204323
OK, now I know that cap, S3 3.4ltr Kiwi market.

Been thinking all day about that snap you showed earlier.

I was productive whilst doing said thinking, spraying POISON. Waaaay to many creepy, crawly, slithering and sliding Aussie gate crashers for our liking. They now be DEAD.
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Old 10-17-2017, 05:00 AM
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Well done Dr Phil, quickie fix, grog out and now the real work begins.
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Old 10-17-2017, 05:17 AM
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Hi Clarke,

Glad all is well and clarified and working.

Just noticed a Freudian Slip with your opening photo on the flat tray.

Am I to understand that at that very point in time you were considering leasing out Fireball?? :-)

Cheers,

Nigel
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Old 10-17-2017, 05:19 AM
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Quote:
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Well done Dr Phil, quickie fix, grog out and now the real work begins.
Just a couple of quiet ones after the job was done
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