So, in an attempt to get rid of the lurch, and to do preventive maintenance at 109k miles, I'm replacing the tranny fluid in my 2000 XK8.

1. How important is doing a full flush vs draining? The ZF holds ~10 quarts, but most tranny shops recommend not flushing and only draining, replacing ~6 quarts with ESSO LT71141.
2. Is there any extra risk doing a flush? I hear there are two different flush tools techniques available.
3. Could mixing the "OEM" ESSO and e.g. Mobile 1 ATF be bad?
4. If not, where can I find a shop/mech willing to use Mobile 1 ATF ($63 for 12 quarts incl. shipping).

So far I've gotten quotes around 340 for a 6 quart replacement with ESSO fluid and a new pan + gasket. 1 year warranty. Ouch.

Ideally I want to pay a (indy)mechanic for 2 hours of labor to do a full flush, and I'll supply a new pan+gasket for $22 incl shipping from Rock Auto and 6 or 10 quarts of Mobile 1 ATF for $9/quart plus $120 or so in labor, landing at a nice ~$200 total

 

Have whomever you do it check your filter before replacing it. I had mine replaced and the mechanic said that the old one wasn't even dirty... I won't be going back there again unless I have to.

I would recommend Hill's Motors in San Mateo. They usually ask if you want parts new OEM or JagHeaven. They also go by shop time instead of charging flat rate AllData quotes and they treat enthusiasts like family.

 

IMO the best way to change fluid is to flush, but flush using the pump in the trans to move the fluid, not an external pump.

Re: Changing filters...After all the work to open the pan and check on a filter, I would change it even if it did not 'look' dirty. A new filter is always good insurance.

 

Except... the filter is $200+ because it's integral to the pan. Not to mention you'll need at least $150 worth of Lifeguard 6. You're certainly not gonna change that regularly, are you?

If the magnet has no shavings and the filter looks clean, you're probably ok putting it back in.

 

Often discussed subject. The drain tribe understand that it takes 3 drains to completely change the fluid and have the opinion that flushing will break up and move junk around a high mileage transmission with potential damage.

Not many flush folks but my opinion, unencumbered with knowledge or experience cannot grasp how moving new fluid through at the same pressure and flow rate as the operating fluid can possibly 'flush' such stuff around and damage the transmission.

Of course, you have to drop the pan and replace the filter before a drain or a flush so the difference appears to me that most of the fluid is changed with one effort.

The Mobile 1 and a number of other brands, including Merc 5 claim to meet the technical LT71141 specifications and I would have no hesitation in mixing any or all of them with the original fluid. The Jaguar/BMW/Esso snake oil marketing has been debunked many times.

The ZF transmission uses a replaceable filter that is really cheap. The MB trans used in the XKR has the integrated pan/filter.

 

Well maybe if I was paying $350 for something I didn't need, then Yes, I might think twice about it. On the other hand, doing the work myself the filter for my '97 5spd was about $60 and fluid was maybe another $50? As TestPoint notes above, there is no reason to purchase pricey ATF when the standard shelf items have proven to meet spec of the OEM fluids.

 

The shop in my area wanted 600$ to do it. I wish I could take it somewhere else

 

Almost any independent shop can drain, replace the filter and fill competently. A local import shop in my little town quoted 2.5 hrs, $200, for the work with me providing fluid and filter which would be another $100.

 

I can recommend Johnny's Automotive on Monument Blvd in Concord. When I bought my 06 Victory, the seller took it to a Jiffy Lube prior to sale to me and I had the lurch and grunt under heavy accel. Tom Hook owner and a smart cookie auto-wise and who has worked on everything of mine from my 49TC, 69Malibu and the XKR, had his top guy Salvador replace the pan/filter draining a lot of the bad fluid, then buttoned that up and power flushed through the trans fluid cooler lines at top left of engine compartment with the new fluid only until the viewers in the flushing machine showed clear fluid only. Used Red Line ATF that met the Shell Spec for ZF, and I have never had the lurch or the grunt since. That was done 2 years ago. I have no affiliation with Johnny's only a happy customer of 20 years. If you go there tell them Syd sent you and Sal will remember the rest about the Transfusion.

 

San Mateo Jaguar uses and recommends Peter Schmidt transmission in Burlingame, a licensed ZF transmission shop, very honest folks! I'll let you guys know what they say when I get a call back from them Peter Schmid Transmissions, MZF - Burlingame, CA

5 - 6 quarts of ZF fluid ~$80
"Oil filter" $45
Gasket $?
Work $180 (~2 hours)

Total $300 - 350

They don't recommend flushing, but it depends what the oil that comes out looks like. Seems like the best people for the job.

 

You can't just drop the pan and replace the filter. You replace the whole pan. The pan can be bought online for $140, so it's not as bad as I originally thought.

 

You have an XKR, I have an XK8. Different transmissions. My filter comes in a box and if I remember correctly it cost about $23.

 

I talked to Johnny, and he quoted me $300 for the fluid alone, full flush, when I politely proposed I could supply or he could use Mobile 1 ATF, he got pissed off and more or less hung up on me. Jikes.

 

Here's an awesome article on how do do the fluid change yourself btw:

Notes/Photos for changing the transmission oil and filter on 1998 E38.

 

Woha, found ER transmissions in Oakland ER Transmissions - Oakland, CA

They will drain using ZF fluid, add a new gasket and filter for $200! Booked.

 

Got the fluid, pan/filter/gasket changed for a beautiful $198 after tax at ER Transmissions.

They have plenty experience with ZF's, both 5 and 6 speed, and the lurch is as far as I can tell completely gone! The owner said it was symptomatic for a clogged filter, maybe it takes time for the tranny to build pressure or something. He also recommended to avoid brutal starts due to some aluminium components in the ZF, other than that he thought it'd last a long time and recommended service at every 15k miles.

 

What kind of service does he recommend at 15,000-mile intervals? If it's a drain-and-fill, that (to me, anyway) is serious overkill. No decent transmission should be that fragile....

 

The most frequent mileage intervals I've seen for ATF changes in any automatic is in the 40-50,000 mile range. Many times I've seen recommendations to change fluids on the 60,000 marker. The 15K interval you mention sounds more like annual overall vehicle maintenance schedules, not transmission related visits.

 

I have flushed my ZF5HP24 two times as a part of a three times flush program. The reason is that the torque converter will hold half a gallon that you are not able to empty unless you disassemble the gearbox. The ATF used is the Mobil LT71141. The pan was removed the first time and gasket and filter was changed. The oil had been in service for 92K miles and 15 yrs. ZF claims that the gearbox is filled and sealed for life. Life is by ZF defined as 10 yrs. or 94k mile (150.000 km).
The trans oil filling procedure is referred elsewhere in this forum or in the ZF Spare Parts Catalog. Remember: The engine SHALL RUN during the filling process or else you have no chance to get the right amount of oil squeezed in to the filling hole. During this process the ATF gets heated and you need to monitor its temperature. I did this on the outlet of the cooling line, using a slightly modified outdoor/indoor temperature gauge used in homes. A little transistor heat compound gave the necessary thermal contact.
The gearbox now operates as smooth as before, even after 1k miles.

 

You can use a hand on the transmission pan for temperature measurement. About the time you think it is too hot to hold is the correct temp for the fill requirement.