Although I use a cloned version (the VCM and Mongoose one), without any issues, I do underline what has been said above. I take my chances, and accept if something goes wrong, as I know what he consequences can be and am prepared to accept them. That I have had no issues at all for the years that I used these, is no guarantee for others, and $500 for the original Mongoose is relatively low for what you get, and you can re-sale the unit afterwards so a good deal imo.

 

Exactly my point, avos. You understand the risks. I just don't want folks advocating knock-offs as absolutely as good as the real item. You know it could bite you and are prepared. Someone else may be totally unprepared for the possibility they could trash a $1500.00 module, or worse. I'm all about helping folks any way I can, but I sure don't want to lead them into a hole like that. Things are expensive enough as it is, nobody needs that.

On the other hand, if you're prepared........have at it!

Cheers,

 

I'm on my 3rd Mongoose Clone now.

First one lasted several months, before I flashed it with the MongoosePro firmware, and it died after several hours use.

The seller was very reluctant to send a replacement. In the end they got me to make a video, showing that nothing happened when I plugged it into the laptop. Eventually they agreed, but I had to send it back to China at my own cost.

To send it by courier wasn't far off the cost of buying another clone, so I sent it economy post, which took a few weeks.

The replacement arrived, I flashed it to a Pro & it lasted a few hours of connected time.

Now I was in a spot of bother as I needed to do a few things on the car, so I bought another clone, the cheapest I could find online (was less than €60 incl delivery).

I haven't flashed this one to Pro, and I'm not going to either...

So far it's holding up. But it's much slower than the Pro. When this one dies, I will most likely buy a genuine one from tuner tools.com as they seem to have the best deal (lowest shipping rates).

In the meantime I will have to put up with the slower speeds, & be a nervous wreck every time I do something critical with it, which frankly, isn't very often these days...

 

... and that is somewhat parallel to my point.

I think it is safe to presume that most rational people would prefer the real deal and are somewhat envious of those who have them and a full subcription. As a professional you get to amortise the cost over hundreds or thouands of uses on chargable work and get a tax writeoff to boot. Or, your employer provides them as a shop tool.

Most readers would also like to have a six foot roller cab filled with Snap-On tools and a tool crib stocked with every official Jaguar special tool. And a tax writeoff for same. Somehow, people muddle through without them anyways.

People are also getting along without a genuine Mongoose.

It's about balanced presentation. Warning a child to not play with matches is wise. But, yelling "FIRE" every time there is a book of matches around is not.

On the matter of reflashing modules, that is completely different from configuring modules and rarely needed or justified. I don't think there are any reported cases of failed flashes directly attributable to the failure to use the genuine article. I would be more worried about user error or failure to read instructions. In those cases, even the genuine article won't keep them out of trouble.

 

I am not jumping on smithtrevor's case, its that his example actually does happen in the US.

Flu shots are offered at drug stores. The people dispensing the injection are complete strangers. The hypodermic is quite possibly a generic version of an otherwise expensive brand-name.

Holy S@#t!

 

I am not offended!Howver your advice was quite inadequate.Just from reading the quote it is clear that you completely underestimate the value of understanding and training in order to be successful in using the SDD/IDS tool.In factyou completely ignore this aspect.

It is unfair to blame a relatively insignificant pass-thru tool without examining the real causes of the failures you descibe.

I think better advice would be to say:

"Don't buy one of these Mongoose tools,clone or real,unless you are prepared to to put in the effort to learn how to use it properly.You risk the tool and your car if you ignore this advice."

 

OK, this one is for rotors 6..

"a bit of free advice"...."i qoute for you...."

"Don't buy one of these Mongoose tools,clone or real,unless you are prepared to to put in the effort to learn how to use it properly.You risk the tool and your car if you ignore this advice."

But there are some of us who dislike paying $100 an hour for a dealer who doesn't give to hoots about your pride & joy, that would rather have a go themselves, so i say again......stay well clear of clones, simple !!

Enough said.

 

As several people have said in previous quotes and as I said the clones are great to read and analyse but I would steer clear of programming modules even with the real tools I have heard of problems when programming. If when reading the CCF files from the vehicle, of which there are three copies, a failure occurs that failure can be written back and can be compounded by any errors caused by the communication device. The VCM clones are not 100% complete they are missing some circuitry and I couldn't obtain all the info of what is missing. In general they use cheaper quality components so yes they may work but when the real tools are sometimes temperamental using a tool which is not 100% in the first place. It is the same in whatever industry you work in the quality of the tool is important for the quality of the end finish.

 

As far as I know the cloned VCM is only missing the circuitry for the wireless lan adaptor. It indeed uses cheaper quality parts, and may also be put together with lower quality controls. My reasoning was that the tool doesn't have to work every day, so for the few days in the many years that I need it figured it would be ok.

Please also read the earlier posts, that its working for me is no guarantee for others.

 

Now you are getting closer!All you need too add to your advice is something like "having a go when you are not sure of what you are doing can be dangerous to your pride and joy--don't do it!"

 

I eventually found this post and it seems to me people are saying that you can easily brick your car with a cloned device but it must be said that you could brick your car with either cloned or genuine device .
Dell

 

Afraid so...do at your own risk !

 

Hey Guys,

Let's show some respect for our dealer techs. Most of the Jaguar specific info here and elsewhere is complements of dealer techs. Dealer techs are usually highly competent and motivated. And truth be told, we work on our cars because we enjoy it.

I "bricked" an X-Type learning to use IDS (failed to use a battery maintainer). But instructions for recovery are elsewhere on this website compliments, in large part, of a dealer tech. "Bricked" modules, unless otherwise defective, can be recovered.

Maximize fun and minimize lost time and frustration:
Use a genuine Drew Tech Mongoose, a battery maintainer and software with configuration files.

 

I started with the same opinion that I would only use the clone occasionally and that cheaper parts would be fine.

If you manage to buy one that reads the CCF from all three locations without a problem then good luck. I did a lot of research o how the SDD worked how to modify and manage the CCF, It is really interesting and would be fun to play with. I design PC networks and system so vehicle networks look like something new and fun to me, I am still looking for a cheap second hand original tool as it is a lot of cash just to play and modify occasionally.

It does seem a lot of people have had the same problem with the clones when using them with a Jaguar or Land Rover but not as many when using with a Ford, maybe the JLR interface is a bit more finicky than the Ford and in the UK jaguar dealers and car specialists do charge a lot to fix home made problems but the specialists I have dealt with have been very helpful and will program what I ask them to do.

 

I have read most of this thread and have found it most interesting. However, the caveats given by some people ("bricking your car", etc.) have scared me out of trying to do any of this stuff myself. Do most Jaguar independent repair shops have the capability to reprogram things?

 

More to the point, there are some people who are shouting "BRICK" when they are not able to personally confirm that any such thing has happened with a clone device that is uniquely attributable to the use of the device. Nor have there been any other confirmed reports of such an outcome.

It is true that some devices have died in infancy. In the reported cases, in only one case has the buyer not received a replacement unit.

There are people who claim to have read this thread thoroughly. Yet, they somehow cannot figure out what the system requirements are, where the documentation can be obtained, how to install the software, or how the software behaves. Notably, all these points have been covered multiple times in this single thread.

It is not at all surprising that such people would have difficulty. And yes, even with the genuine article they would face the same difficulties because the genuine article also relies on properly installed software, and proper operator education. All of that requires a willingness to read all of the available material whether it is documentation or informational posts.

To put statements or claims into context, readers can always go back and review prior posts by the same person. If the prior posts show that they have been flailing about like a fish out of water, then maybe they ought to stick to water.

 

The JLR variant uses an additional industrial control protocol.

 

That would probably account for the extra problems that I had loading the CCF from the vehicle and even more reason not to use clones.

 

Not necessarily as it is a published industrial protocol.

Now, have you been able to read the CCF from all three locations using a genuine device where you had previously failed on the same vehicle using the same software installation?

In addition, the usefulness of SDD/IDS is not limited to flashing modules. The majority of people have no reason to reflash modules and yet have reason to use SDD/IDS. Even in a dealership setting it is highly doubtful that the use of SDD/IDS is primarily for the purpose of reflashing modules.

 

Yes you are correct, in the factory IDS/SDD is only used to fault find a unit off-line, if after investigation a module is dead or won't hold a download then it is replaced and re programmed ( it is a brick at this point) by the factory broadcast via the unique VIN.
This kit is linked directly to the plants network and the download is taken directly from the PVS server.