XJ6 & XJ12 Series I, II & III 1968-1992

Weird pepperpot wheels

 
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Old 06-14-2019, 04:31 PM
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Default Weird pepperpot wheels

I have a set of 15" pepperpot wheels with a checkered background. Someone had painted the center portion black with the rim part shiny alloy. Finally got them cleaned up and ordered a set of hubcaps. Here are the parts I ordered:


C-42191 Growler hub caps
CAC-6442 Retainer rings


But when I went to install them I snapped the badges into the retainer rings but when I tried to put them in the wheels they were too small of diameter and fell through. The retainer ring measures 50mm and the hole in the center of the wheels is 55mm. Were pepperpots used on another brand of car that had different specs? The wheels fit the car perfectly, just that the center hole is too big or I have the wrong retainer rings. Any ideas?



Jeff
 
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Old 06-14-2019, 04:58 PM
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you might have the wrong center rings.

I have two spare chromed rings from my
Teardrop wheels. I will measure them and let you know but get me the hole measurement in inches, I hate millimiters, or mini limiters, whatever it is.
 
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Old 06-14-2019, 08:45 PM
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[QUOTE=Yellow series3;2085029]I have a set of 15" pepperpot wheels with a checkered background. Someone had painted the center portion black with the rim part shiny alloy. Finally got them cleaned up and ordered a set of hubcaps. Here are the parts I ordered:


C-42191 Growler hub caps
CAC-6442 Retainer rings


Were pepperpots used on another brand of car that had different specs? The wheels fit the car perfectly, just that the center hole is too big or I have the wrong retainer rings. Any ideas?


Yes indeed...I had exactly the same experience. In photos they look (almost) the same but in reality they are quite different. In addition to that centre hub hole problem you mention, the central part of the wheel is much flatter than on the correct OEM wheels (called"pepperpots" but in fact made/designed for Jaguar by Ogle -they were not used on any other car. The correct but never-used name is Ogle Perforated wheels); the real Jaguar wheel has quite a convex dome shape to the central part.
The ersatz wheels were made for Jeep Wagoneers, not Jaguars. I gave my faux set away gratis.
 

Last edited by sov211; 06-14-2019 at 08:48 PM.
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Old 06-15-2019, 05:26 AM
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those are the Metric Version as I understand itt.
 
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Old 06-15-2019, 10:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Jose View Post
those are the Metric Version as I understand itt.
Note sure what you mean by this, Jose. There were no metric versions of the Ogle wheels. The Ogle wheels were fitted only to the Series III Sovereigns, and as a no-cost option, an alternate to the Kent wheels, to the Daimlers and for Canada, the V12 Vanden Plas. The metric sized wheels were for the later XJ40 cars but they were not "pepperpots".

The correct Ogle wheels - fitted on a 1990 V12 VDP. Note the convex shape of the central portion:

 

Last edited by sov211; 06-15-2019 at 10:40 AM.
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Old 06-15-2019, 01:30 PM
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Gregory I understand there is a "metric" version of both the Pepperpot and the Teardrop wheels. Both are not 15" diameter but close, and they are flatter as you describe.
 
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Old 06-15-2019, 01:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Jose View Post
Gregory I understand there is a "metric" version of both the Pepperpot and the Teardrop wheels. Both are not 15" diameter but close, and they are flatter as you describe.
I can only answer by saying that metric wheels were never fitted to the Series III cars (including the very last 1992 cars), and that further, the ill-fated Jaguar metric wheels, fitted only to the XJ40 cars, were not, absolutely not, "pepperpot" wheels (although there was a perforated design, but not similar to the Ogle wheels - these are, I think, the "teardrop" wheels you mention).

You may think that my reference to the Jeep was tongue-in-cheek...it was not. The Jeeps had a faux-pepperpot wheel design and I believe that it what I (briefly) had and what our OP has.
 
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Old 06-15-2019, 02:03 PM
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While we're on the subject, I actually traveled all the way to Rome yesterday to buy a set of the Pepperpot/Ogle Perforated wheels. Well, Rome, Georgia that is. After keeping an eye out for a set of pepperpot wheels for years (without paying huge shipping fees) a junkyard only 50 miles away had a set. They need a good cleaning and refinishing, but no noticeable damage or curb rash.

They came off a Series III V12, and the car was still on the lot although it was in very sad shape. I think it may have been a gray market import rather than a Canadian spec Vanden Plas V12. As best I could tell, the VIN on the A Pillar/windshield plate and the one stamped into the plate where the engine bay cross members meet was the same: SAJJDRLW4CC419914. I couldn't open the driver's door to see the VIN sticker. The junkyard owner was pretty knowledgeable about Jaguars and if you believe his story (and this would be a weird one to make up) the car was once owned by Truett Cathy of chick-fil-a fame.
 
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Old 06-15-2019, 05:28 PM
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Great score, Noah.

Really embarrassing to find out my pepperpots are not the genuine article. I am working on an intim hub cap solution so I can use them until I find a nice, reasonably priced set of real ones. I guess I'll call these my faux-pepperpots.
 
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Old 06-15-2019, 08:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Yellow series3 View Post
Great score, Noah.

Really embarrassing to find out my pepperpots are not the genuine article. I am working on an intim hub cap solution so I can use them until I find a nice, reasonably priced set of real ones. I guess I'll call these my faux-pepperpots.

Would it help to remember that that you are not alone in this? I too fell prey to this hoax.
 
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Old 06-15-2019, 08:47 PM
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Well .... at least I am in good company!
 
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Old 06-16-2019, 09:45 AM
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[QUOTE=Noah;2085353

They came off a Series III V12, and the car was still on the lot although it was in very sad shape. I think it may have been a gray market import rather than a Canadian spec Vanden Plas V12. As best I could tell, the VIN on the A Pillar/windshield plate and the one stamped into the plate where the engine bay cross members meet was the same: SAJJDRLW4CC419914..[/QUOTE]

Noah: that VIN translates as follows:
SAJJ = Jaguar, Jaguar marque badged
D = Double Six (meaning a V12 car)
R = Vanden Plas specification
L = 4 door saloon
W = 5.3 litre B emissions
4 = Left hand steering
C (undetermined here because A would signify the Daimler limousine, B would mean a Series III car, and normally a C indicates Canada but only if the VIN numerals following show a 1982 model year - in this case the model year indicated is 1985 (see below). All V12 VDP cars were for Canada only from 1986 model year to 1992 inclusive.
C = Browns Lane factory
419914 indicates 1985 model year (1985 started with 389879 and 1986 started with 431604).

In other words, this is almost certainly a European grey market car, as you suspected; if it does not have the trip computer then is is definitely a European, probably German import.
 
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Old 06-16-2019, 10:08 AM
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Perhaps some pictures of these so others will know how to recognize them?
 
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Old 06-16-2019, 11:20 AM
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I can only add a word of caution. Are the Faux pepper pots safe on the Jaguar.

1. The angle of the lug nuts must be compatible with the seat on the heel fopr those nuts. 37 degrees or 45? or whatever, they must match.

2. The center hole of the wheels must be the same as the center of the jaguar hub.
Centrific application.

Just for the fun, google up Jeep Wagoner stuff and see if any have wheels that look like the "real" jaguar Pepper pots!!

Carl
 
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Old 06-16-2019, 12:59 PM
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Below is a photo of the faux-pepperpots. You can see that Gregory's wheels are more rounded, like an upside down bowl. Mine are pretty much flat. If you didn't know what to look for and/or didn't have them side by side it would be hard to tell. But the big issue is the center caps. The hub hole on the genuine Jaguar wheels measures 2" in diameter. On the faux ones the center hole measures a little over 2 1/8". Or exactly 55mm. You can see mine have a plain plastic cap. If it has a genuine Jaguar hub cap with retainer ring it probably is the real McCoy.

Assuming that it has the right lug nuts and fits correctly I would say it is a reasonable alternative until I find the real thing.

 
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Old 06-16-2019, 01:30 PM
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I have a cheap 'n esay fix. Buy a Jaguar sticker off Ebay and stick it on the center. I did it with aftermarket wheels on my VW and they've been there for some years now..
 
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Old 06-16-2019, 01:36 PM
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Interesting, those look nice to me. Are they 6.5" wide rather than 6" like the pepperpots? When I was looking for a set, one vendor said he had a set of rare pepperpot wheels that were 6.5" wide and had a flat center. I'm guessing they were like the ones you have.
 
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Old 06-16-2019, 10:08 PM
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Another tiny clue to identify the genuine Jaguar Pepperpots:

The part number is stamped right on the wheel!

CAC5667





Cheers

DD
 
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Old 06-17-2019, 10:49 AM
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For the record, here are the numbers cast in the faux wheels:
JC1565
5X4.75
ET33
6.5JX15

So, Noah, yes, I would guess these are the "rare 6.5" wheels the guy was trying to sell you.

Muttony, great idea on the stickers. I found a set that will fill out the plastic center cap and they look like the center cap of the modern Jaguars. Embossed metal with black background. It will be interesting to see if anyone comments on my weird pepperpots. Anyone has a nice set of genuine pepperpots for a reasonable price please let me know.

Jeff
 
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Old 06-17-2019, 11:27 AM
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Not safe in my lexicon. The hole in the wheel is too big! Not a fit with the Jaguar hub. Relies on the lug nuts only!!! Not good!!!

Elinor can tell you about wheels that seem to fit, but do not. A correct spacer solved her issue.

Carl
 
 
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