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Got some smoke and then the wheel got heavy. Zipping across the Verrazano Bridge this morning - yup, a heap of new work... HP Power Steering Hose gave it up.
If I have to drive a mile or two without PS fluid to get home will this BURN up the pump?
I have a new hose waiting, the high pressure side, and am wondering if the job can be done from up top? If I undo everything, the U in the line at the front sub frame, from the pump giving some slack, can the nut on the rack be reached with the breather housing completely removed reaching down from thru the bonnet? I have long arms. Shoot, I'll lay across the engine.
I'm here at work and the planning is going on in my head and I just wanna idea of what I'll be looking at. I have a 500mile drive this coming weekend to look at a potential new house upstate NY (garage included!!!), my lady is depending on me, and I don't want to let her (us) down...
ICSAmerica and I changed the rear shocks and springs this weekend. While I was messing around with that ICS installed 2 new front subframe donut bushings up front. Might have had something to do with the HP Hose touching the heat shield on the LH side. When I looked the hydrolic fitting on the hose closest to the rack tower was right up against the heat shield. Anyways,,,,
This car is making me nutts.
Any direction for the job is SUPER appreciated!
EDIT - No CATs in the way... I have a feeling I'll be under that car tonight out front of my place.
Last edited by JayJagJay; Mar 29, 2021 at 07:35 AM.
Got some smoke and then the wheel got heavy. Zipping across the Verrazano Bridge this morning - yup, a heap of new work... HP Power Steering Hose gave it up.
If I have to drive a mile or two without PS fluid to get home will this BURN up the pump?
I have a new hose waiting, the high pressure side, and am wondering if the job can be done from up top? If I undo everything, the U in the line at the front sub frame, from the pump giving some slack, can the nut on the rack be reached with the breather housing completely removed reaching down from thru the bonnet? I have long arms. Shoot, I'll lay across the engine.
I'm here at work and the planning is going on in my head and I just wanna idea of what I'll be looking at. I have a 500mile drive this coming weekend to look at a potential new house upstate NY (garage included!!!), my lady is depending on me, and I don't want to let her (us) down...
ICSAmerica and I changed the rear shocks and springs this weekend. While I was messing around with that ICS installed 2 new front subframe donut bushings up front. Might have had something to do with the HP Hose touching the heat shield on the LH side. When I looked the hydrolic fitting on the hose closest to the rack tower was right up against the heat shield. Anyways,,,,
This car is making me nutts.
Any direction for the job is SUPER appreciated!
EDIT - No CATs in the way... I have a feeling I'll be under that car tonight out front of my place.
On a V12, you can't reach or even see the pressure line nuts on the rack without removing the rack mounting bolts, the steering shaft universal from the pinion, and then pulling down the rack. Leave the tie rods connected so the rack does not fall out of the car. The various heat shields in the area are in the way. Even if they are gone I don't think you could get to the lines. For the pump, just cut the belt to get it home. EDIT: BAD advice; that belt drives the water pump. You don't want to take the chance of burning up the pump. The alternative is to cut the HP hose, and loop it back to the LP port of the pump, and fill the pump with fluid.
On a V12, you can't reach or even see the pressure line nuts on the rack without removing the rack mounting bolts, the steering shaft universal from the pinion, and then pulling down the rack. Leave the tie rods connected so the rack does not fall out of the car. The various heat shields in the area are in the way. Even if they are gone I don't think you could get to the lines.
For the pump, just cut the belt to get it home. You don't want to take the chance of burning up the pump. The alternative is to cut the HP hose, and loop it back to the LP port of the pump, and fill the pump with fluid.
I hear ya and I think your right. I can't really get down and dirty on a short break from work BUT I have gone for a look and I can't even see the tower in any real way... I don't really want to get under this damn thing tonight. Hmm
My worry about cutting the belt is it is shared with the water pump. And then, is there a danger in pumping high pressure fluid INTO the pump on the (usually) low pressure return?
No. The low pressure port just dumps into the reservoir in the pump.
I'll have to go look at the belt arrangement. I was thinking the PS was a separate belt, but I'm probably wrong.
Be aware that your new HP line may be different from the original. They supercede to a new style. They fit differently. And the generics that places like Rock Auto sells are different yet again. The generics don't have the clocking tabs that keep the LP and HP lines in the proper relation to each other at the rack. They'll all work, but you'll have to figure out how. I'm currently going thru this as I replace a leaky rack.
No. The low pressure port just dumps into the reservoir in the pump.
I'll have to go look at the belt arrangement. I was thinking the PS was a separate belt, but I'm probably wrong.
Be aware that your new HP line may be different from the original. They supercede to a new style. They fit differently. And the generics that places like Rock Auto sells are different yet again. The generics don't have the clocking tabs that keep the LP and HP lines in the proper relation to each other at the rack. They'll all work, but you'll have to figure out how. I'm currently going thru this as I replace a leaky rack.
I did what you suggested and cut the hose and turned it back to clamp into the low pressure return. GREAT suggestion, Thank you.
I have a great local parts supplier (I don't know why I order from others soooo often) and I hope they got it right. My issue kinda is I also had a leaking rack when the XJS saga began and I replaced it with a 1992 rack. We shall see. I plan to do this tonight after work.
Since I have no CATs I am going to begin with just undoing the 2 bolts, maybe even just the top one on the LH side, loosening others, to see how much play that gives me. I'm hoping this car will take it easy on me and allow me to DO this disassembling as LITTLE as possible.
I went and looked at my car, and you were absolutely right about the belt. I edited my post.
Glad you were able to loop the hose. If the pump had locked up on the way home, it likely would have broken the belt and stopped the water pump.
Let us know how you succeed in changing the hose. Post a picture of where it failed. Portions of the hoses are supposed to have metallized fiberglass heat shields to protect them from downpipe heat. Hope yours have them.
PITA, isn't it?!
Stubby wrench can help with connection at the pump. Once that connection is broken loose, a stubby wrench can get almost a 180 degree throw.
It may be easier to remove the HP line at the rack if you remove or disconnect one or both of the lines that run along the rack itself. I didn't say easy, I said easier...
PITA, isn't it?!
Stubby wrench can help with connection at the pump. Once that connection is broken loose, a stubby wrench can get almost a 180 degree throw.
It may be easier to remove the HP line at the rack if you remove or disconnect one or both of the lines that run along the rack itself. I didn't say easy, I said easier...
Yes.it.is....! PITA that is,,,
I got the rack down, lines off. New lines on and struggled to get the rack back up. Realized the difficulty had to do with the fact that I had mis-routed the HP line under not over the motor mount. Under the mount created a terrible kink in the line that made realignment of the rack bolts impossible. Had to undo everything again.
Got REALLY frustrated once I got the lines discon again (to the point of not working well) and foolishly decided to discon the knuckle for the steering arm (I'll regret that) which didn't come apart easy - and then just stopped for the day as soon as things got tough again.
Quite a bit done,,,, and then UNdone again, between 4 and 7xx o'clock but walked away feeling a bit defeated. Lol,,, for a sec I was telling myself - "self,,, this ain't so bad". Then it was BAD, haha. Jeeeeeze Louise.
One thing that helped with the LPressure line was undoing the jubilee clamp and threading out and in the LP fitting without the hose attached - then the same in re-install - then doing up the hose after. Another thing that helped was not exactly placing the rigid U shaped section of the hose at the front of the subframe but leaving it loose after I got the orientation right - left for a lot of slack in the hose at the rack end. It's just all so tight and unforgiving in there.
Tomorrow (after 3.30) is another day.
I hope to take it slow-er and snapping some photos.
I haven't been so good at that for the forums sake. I need a garage where I have more time. This working in the street poses TONS of troubles.
Be aware that your new HP line may be different from the original. They supercede to a new style. They fit differently. And the generics that places like Rock Auto sells are different yet again. The generics don't have the clocking tabs that keep the LP and HP lines in the proper relation to each other at the rack. They'll all work, but you'll have to figure out how. I'm currently going thru this as I replace a leaky rack.
I've fought that battle. Once.
Next time I took the old hose to a hydraulics shop and had them make me a new one in the same configuration. Of course, that option isn't always available to others every time. But if circumstances permit, that's what I recommend
Next time I took the old hose to a hydraulics shop and had them make me a new one in the same configuration. Of course, that option isn't always available to others every time. But if circumstances permit, that's what I recommend
Cheers
DD
I ordered the part and hadn't considered this potential problem... I'm glad things worked out. Believe me, when I read J's post about the possibility,,, I got anxious...
It was also late to heed Greg's warnings about springs that are WAY more robust than the OEM,,, the ones I got from Welsh are on the car now with the new shocks - I'll be reporting on that difference in part as soon as I get this thing going again... My goodness. Yup,,, robust springs 12mm gauge coil as opposed to 10mm gauge per round I took off...
Last edited by JayJagJay; Mar 30, 2021 at 05:40 AM.
Has anyone eliminated or heard of anyone eliminating that long U shaped ridged section of piping in the HP Power Steering hose line and, if so, can something like a brass barbed connector be used?
For me, if it was possible to eliminate that crazy section of steel pipe but to KEEP the cooler, or even run a separate cooler out front behind the grill, I might consider it. I'd imagine that the U shaped ridged section must have something to do with cooling???
It's the U that makes this hard. Well, one of the things.
NO BARBED CONNECTORS - I promise...
Thanks for stopping me, Greg...!
Well, I was just kinda asking but the thought - well, you know.
So, mission accomplished. So far so good.
That little signal dot (under an allen bolt in my car) signifying the center of the rack in re-aligning the shaft in the (ZF) rack, and hence the wheels was a life saver. So that when well.
All and all 1 hour of steady right work,,, 3 hours of wrestling. Here's what I think I take away from it all...
Mind ya I have NO CATs in the way.
- Remove air filter and and entire breather housing.
- Remove and disconnect all of the old PS hose in that area and if possible un-pin from the front subframe and push that rigid U shaped steel section up and into the cavity just under the air box as much as possible.
- undo everything to do with the return line at the pump or at the cooler if fitted.
If you are convinced that the HP line is shot just CUT the hose as close to the steering wrack tower as you can so there is just a stub left... That's what I will do next time. Why wrestle with it?
- Remove silver heat shield - two 11mm bolts.
- If I had CATs I would have needed to remove the oil filter.
- Just unbolt all 3 rack bolts and be done with it. (A 1/2 offset wrench works best) 1/2 bolts and nutts on mine. For the top bolt on the US LH side get a good long ratchet extension and string it threw from the space on the left hand side. Dont struggle with trying to fit something in the narrow space with no wrench turning room from straight underneath the nutt/bolt.
- undo the pinch bolt - just do it... And let it fall.
- Drop the rack but DON'T undo the tie rod ends.
- undo the low pressure (bottom) hose 16mm first
- undo the upper 1/2 or 13mm HP hose connector next
I used a jack stand to help hold and support the rack UP while I fiddled today. Placed it on the LH driver's side control arm which gave me a ton more support and amazing about of added control. I'm STILL soar after working without the jack stand yesterday - OMG...
I actually think this job (and how would I know other wise) is easier in ones back than trying to work over head for the re-connecting of the lines. Again, what do I know...
To reconnect the HP line on the top port I found it made a bunch of sense to push as much of both ends of the new hose into that cavity under the air box allowing for a bunch of slack in the line. Without this, if the rigid line is in or near it's proper place at the front of the subframe getting the rigid end of the line (the part that threads into rack) is nearly impossible due to the angle one needs to hold the rack to properly get ones hands in the space... Even with slack it's tough... Hmm... I BELIEVE that on my rack (ZF made rack) it's tough to see,,,, BUT I believe the ports on the rack at a super slight angle to the LH side. Something to account and adjust for in trying to start the threads...
Do not rush the threading or allow a cross thread into the rack. Take as MUCH time as it takes.
My new hose did NOT have the bracket that connects the HP and return lines. I'm happy for that. And, when I installed this rack at the beginning of my XJS journey, I cut the steel stem of the return understanding it to be low pressure and used a hose clamp to connect the low pressure hose to. Made life easy today, let's just hope - I'm not even going to say it...
- Thread and tighten the upper HP line.
- Thread and tighten the low pressure line.
Then breath... The rest ain't bad at all...
I will say that that "FINDER" for the center of the rack is brilliant and makes life a lot easier on reinstall - reassembly. As long as that dot lines up and you get everything back together (unless I missed something that I will discover when I drive into work tomorrow) you can remove the steering wheel and center it where it needs to be.
I'm sure I will re-read this after posting and edit,,, make some changes...
And I am SUPER open for questions OR, and more, if folks have pointers or can clarify where I didn't explain well or correctly...
Another thing that might be worth mentioning is that the entire area is pretty grimy. I can't imagine grit and dirt inside of any part of the PS system is a good idea. With the grit and grim I can't imagine that it would be possible to re-install and thread the connectors without sweeping the grit and grim into the rack ports.
What I did while the rack was down, disconnected from the lines and hanging by the arms is near completely turn the rack upside down and spray and clean the entire area. Upside down so gravity would help to flush while spraying. I used a spray bottle of 90% isopropyl alcohol a squirted directly into the ports and let it drain, out came the alcohol and PS (trans) fluid. I used alcohol because the quarters are cramped and brake cleaner and other solvents are toooo noxious.
1990 Jaguar XJS - Exploded HP Power Steering Hose
