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That doesn't sound good. Any check engine light? Have you looked under the car to see if you might have run over a tree branch that is making contact with the fan? That happened to my wife a while ago and the sound was awful but no CEL.
Hopefully, it's not a serious internal engine component.
The Dealer said the variable valve tensioner and timing was shot. $8000 estimate to fix.
The British Auto Repair shop said the oil was down to 2.5 quarts, black, burnt, with metal flakes in it. New engine, $15,000 estimate.
A third repair shop said they found an oil leak that was pooling in a drip tray, and found metal flakes in the new oil that was replaced by the second shop.
I've owned the car 5 months, drove just under 4000 miles. No oil light, no check engine light, nothing wrong with the car until this started weekend before last.
The dealer that sold it to me had it serviced prior to the sale by the same jaguar dealership I took it to last week.
Could a pothole cause damage like an oil leak? That's the only possible explanation I can come up with, other than incompetence on the jaguar dealer's part.
With all the tow charges and diagnostic fees, I'm already down a grand and no clear solution has emerged.
Just devastated. Figured I would check the forum to see if anyone had a better explanation than those I've received thus far.
Tomorrow, I'm hoping to get my hands on the diagnostic report the Jag dealer generated back when I first bought the car. They gave me one last week that said the oil level was fine, and viscosity, too. If they said the same thing a few months ago, I'm turning it over to my insurance company.
I think the dealer could be right, VVT failure, (gummed up with either wrong oil or old oil)
This happened to a guy in UK on the other forum. The short of it was that the independent service shop acknowledged the wrong viscosity oil was use.
However he got a check engine light first.
Start reading the Ftype forum (same exact engine)
I seem to have come across someone who had something similar and ended up doing many things including supercharger only to find out it was something else smaller.
Your best recourse is to lean on misrepresentation.
Which is what happened, you were told 5 months ago, service was performed on schedule on this car.
I dont see how it could be 2.5qts low with oil changed 5 months ago. (which answers your question)
But first track down that source of oil leak. It may provide a vital clue.
It appears that 4 months ago you bought a 2011 XKR from an independent used car dealer who represented that he had it serviced by a Jaguar dealer prior to selling it to you. As an 8 year old used car, I suspect that the Bill of Sale provides that it was sold on an "as-is, where-is" basis, with no warranties except for good title.
I feel your pain and regret being the bearer of bad news. If the facts are as I described above, you have an uphill battle to collect anything from that dealer unless your state has a "lemon law" that covers your circumstances. How do you prove fraudulent misrepresentation if that dealer sent it to a Jaguar dealer to be serviced and inspected prior to sale?
You stated: "I'm turning it over to my insurance company." Did you buy a third party extended service contract for this XKR? If not, what type of insurance do you have that will cover this type of claim?
Stuart
P.S. Unfortunately, you are beyond the limits of making a claim under Arizona's lemon law for used cars, which is the earlier of 15 days or 500 miles after you bought that XKR. https://www.azag.gov/consumer/auto
Click the link to Arizona's Lemon Law
Last edited by Stuart S; 03-18-2019 at 11:17 AM.
Reason: Added P.S.
StuartS, if the Jag Dealership provided the independent dealer with the same diagnostic report that stated the oil level and viscosity was good I received last week, then clearly the Jag Dealership did not perform the work for which both of us were charged. Comprehensive insurance does not cover normal wear and tear, nor is an owner covered for damage due to his or her own negligence. However, if the vehicle damage occured as the result of a pothole, the claim is viable. Queen and Country is on point: in this case, either the Jag Dealer misrepresented the condition of the car to the independent dealer, or the independent dealer misrepresented the condition of the car to the buyer. I was told the car belonged to the owner of the dealership, a fact that in and of itself implies the car's condition was good. The reason the car was sent to the Jaguar Dealership by the independent dealer was because it overheated on my way home immediately after purchasing the vehicle. After diagnosing the issue, a cooling fan and sensor were replaced by the Jag Dealer. 4000 miles and 4 months later, the oil level was 2.5 Quarts, burnt black. The Jag Dealer charged me $200 for a diagnostic which included an oil level and viscosity check, stating both were good (green), a blatant misrepresentation. I agree with your assessment that I am facing an uphill battle, for sure. Hopefully, the insurance company is willing to fight on my behalf.
Queen and Country, thank you for the advice. I'm researching the F-Type forums now.
This is what I would do.
With an open heart and mind, I would start visiting in person the service techs who worked on your car.
Under the pretense that you need learn the history of your new purchase and start a relationship. (both of which you need to do anyway)
After getting the history, inform them that something does not add up, your engine blew after 4000 miles of taking delivery.
Make some friends there, relief is what you need and the history is what you need.
You can always scorch the earth at some later point, if all fails.
There is a last effort strategy you can use where their cooperation will be essential. (lets talk of this later)
You have some digging to do. Get the info firsthand. BTW if this was owned and serviced by a Jaguar dealer, wrong oil is out.
(My experience with Jaguar techs has been incredible, I came across a superb low mileage XKR, there was just one catch it was from Chicago. No one could tell me its history, more importantly if it had been driven in winter. Found Service Manager who worked on the car, in 2 minutes he told be avoid, its an exception that its been used throughout winter)
When the car was originally serviced by the Jag Dealership, I was told their master mechanic replaced the cooling fan because he didn't like how the cooling fan sounded after they replaced the sensor. I was so impressed, I felt compelled to write a thank you letter to express my gratitude. I see the wisdom in your advice, Queen and Country. Something definitely does not add up, but now is not the time to alienate the ones most knowledgeable about my car's history and future service needs.
Hopefully, your XKR's oil pan will have a dent and small crack or hole in it to support your auto insurance collision damage claim. Don't forget the corresponding damage to the belly pan. It's easy to run over a pothole, large rock or other object that you didn't see in the roadway that damages the underside of your vehicle.
I doubt that your automobile insurance company will "fight on your behalf" to collect anything from the seller or Jaguar dealer. What did they do to be liable under your automobile policy? Fraudulent misrepresentation isn't covered by collision or comprehensive coverage. You'll need to engage a lawyer to sue them on those grounds, and there's no guarantee that you'll win because you drove it for 4,000 miles with no problems.
Fortunately, no harm was done except to your wallet. You can always replace the money, but not necessarily your health.
To the OP. I also had a bad experience last year w/ a used car dealer from Arizona. I took the word of a used car salesman when he told me prior to my purchase that the car it was in great shape. No oil leaks, no paint issues, near perfect leather interior, and so on. Well, after the car was delivered my mechanic took a look at the car and it was a mess. Bad rear main seal, leaking rear differential, torn leather seats, broken interior plastic and so on. The car needed over $3,000 worth of repairs. That's when I got mad and went after the car dealer with my guns loaded.
If the OP bought the car from an independent dealer that sells cars via the internet (most do today) then his reputation is at stake. If the used car salesman lied to you about the condition of the car then that is outright fraud. Contact the dealer and demand money for repairs. I went after my car dealer by filing a complaint with the Arizona Better Business Bureau and threatened to post bad reviews on Yelp! and Auto Trader, Cars.com and others. Other potential buyers will read the bad reviews and it will hurt the dealer's business. He doesn't want that.
This is a long post but the OP needs some direction. I got my satisfaction to the tune of over $3,000. I hope he pursues his case and gets his.
The reason the car was sent to the Jaguar Dealership by the independent dealer was because it overheated on my way home immediately after purchasing the vehicle.
Disclose all facts if you are hoping for a reasonable advice. If the car ever overheated, then it is different from if components started to fail due to lack of maintenance.
However, bad news, that these engines do not generally survive overheating.
I find it difficult to believe that these engines just blow . Somehow I think this all started with the overheat issue which sounds like it wan't diagnosed or fixed correctly. How hot did it get and for how long. As for the low oil situation I would think that checking it yourself prior to leaving the dealer would have verified it was full. Just feel something doesn't add up Good luck in getting it resolved.
I took the car for a test drive, and had no issues. On the way home after purchasing the vehicle, the A/C started blowing hot and then a warning came up saying the car was about to overheat. I pulled over, tried calling the dealer but they were closed. Limped another 5 miles home, with the warning coming up at stop lights. The dealership had it towed the next morning.
There is no evidence of an oil leak in my garage whatsoever. The dealership I bought the car from has not been very helpful thus far, their manager appears to be dodging my calls. I emailed the owner of the dealership and explained what happened, asked for the service records from when the car was serviced back in October. 5.5 quarts of oil does not just vanish into thin air.
Here's what the Jag Dealership gave me last Monday.
And here's what the British Repair shop stated the next day:
The whiteout is because I removed the name of the dealership and the VIN, my personal info, etc.
The only reaming question is which came first, neglected oil or engine wear. Logic says oil.
They did you right at this dealership. Basically they performed diagnosis that would have cost you thousands of dollars elsewhere in guessing, as you saw from Stholen's experience, and got right to the heart of the matter for the price of an oil change.
You may get away with changing the timing chain, tensioner, guides and vvt. (all of which would be due someday anyway) and pray the metal flakes were from the chain slapping the shroud. (which explains the inconsistent noise)
Its a crying shame that folks take oil so lightly, it controls the timing in our engines. Morons dont realize that they are causing a lot of agony to someone else down the road such as yourself.
03-17-2019, 08:47 PM
