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Convertible top constantly trying to open while car is on.
I recently brought my car (2016 F-Type R Convertible) to an out-of-town auto shop due to a coolant leak. While it was there, they said that the battery was dead and it required jumping. As soon as they jumped it, the soft top motor kicked on and it attempted to open the top, but it was latched so it just kept struggling. I thought this was weird, but had them replace the battery.
When I went to pick it up, as soon as I started the car the soft top tried to open, struggling against the latch, and didn't stop until I turned off the car. I went inside and told them, and they came out and helped me manually close the top, as it had opened half an inch or so, and remove fuse 9 so it wouldn't try to do it anymore. I asked if they had left my car outside the past 9 days that they had it in their care, and they said they had. Well, it has rained a lot recently, and my concern is now that because they failed to properly store or cover it, there has been water incursion on my battery and maybe the board that handles the soft top.
My local shop is saying that they need between 2 and 8 hours to diagnose the issue, but I've told them that is a pretty wild swing in labor just to diagnose if it's electrical or mechanical. So, I'm hesitant to leave it with them.
I'm tempted to try and put the fuse back in and see if it works, and maybe just needed time to dry (assuming water damage is the cause)? I've never dealt with this issue before, though, and was hoping that somebody here had any experience with it. Things to check, steps to recommend, etc.
Thanks!
Additional Info:
I have the codes recorded from the out-of-town shop:
GWM
B1412-96 | Quiescent relay box | Permanent
FTCMB
U0206-00 | Lost communication with convertible top control module | Permanent
IPMB
U0140-08 | Lost communication with BCM. | Intermittent
Last edited by BarneyChampaign; Apr 14, 2025 at 02:16 PM.
What happens if you allow the top to complete the top-down cycle? Does it stop trying to retract the top?
Could it be the console switch? (I doubt it, but try actuating it several times with the car OFF, that might clean the contacts)
Along those lines, if you could disconnect & re- connect the plugs to the three modules, and look for stressed wiring, that is another lower-cost possible fix.
Sorry, I don't know where they hide those modules, but the Shop Manual or the Harper Jaguar Parts listing might help, there.
1) The coolant leak - what was it and did they fix it? This can be an engine killer. Just read the posts on this forum about this one topic alone.
2) The battery issue - was that when the work was completed for the coolant leak? Leaving the doors unlocked or ignition on for a few minutes during repair is enough to take out the battery.
3) Was the window left open a crack in the rain? Can you check the carpets for dampness? The BCM module is under the passenger floor carpet.
The drains for the convertible top can become clogged with debris leading to an overflow situation. Use the "Search this Forum" link in the top right corner when you are on the main page:
@Carbuff2 :
I'm nervous about putting the fuse (9 on drivers side) back in to try the top, in case I am unable to manually fasten it back down. I did also check fuse 6 drivers side, and neither it nor 9 appear damaged. I also don't understand how the motor shaft that you have to manually screw when manually. latching the roof plays into things. Do I have to re-adjust that before trying to operate the roof electronically, to re-engage it or something? The manual only has instructions on how to close the roof manually, but not how to open it or re-engage it for normal use.
@JagCode3 :
1) The coolant leak was due to a cracked outlet, but since they were taking out the supercharger anyways I went ahead and had them replace the water pump as well as any hoses/gaskets/etc. that looked to be going soon. That appears to be fixed, as coolant level has maintained since the repair.
2) The battery they noticed when trying to drive the car into the shop for initial work. It sat in their parking lot for 8 days, through heavy rain, and on the 9th they had to jump it to drive it inside because it was dead. That's when they tested the battery and determined it was bad, even though I bought a brand new OEM Jaguar battery, installed by the dealership, less than 2 years ago. This is also when they said they heard the top trying to open itself, unsuccessfully, as soon as they jumped it.
3) I didn't notice anything being damp when I picked it up.
I've found and read up on several posts here, trying to find some answers or steps to try to resolve it myself. Since I don't know how to try and lower now, though, I have no way of looking at the drains or the mechanisms that drive the top. I wish I could find a guide on how to safely lower the top manually, but haven't found one yet.
@BarneyChampaign Thanks for the info. We definitely want to help you figure this out. I think the rain overwhelmed the drains. The motors are still good if it is trying to open.
I will do some digging since this is a new issue to learn for me but could potentially affect all convertible owners.
I would get your car back from the shop and let it dry out in your safe abode. Reading the posts - there have been very few positive experiences when using a shop or dealer to fix this.
Do you have a convertible top specialist in your area?
@BarneyChampaign Thanks for the info. We definitely want to help you figure this out. I think the rain overwhelmed the drains. The motors are still good if it is trying to open.
I will do some digging since this is a new issue to learn for me but could potentially affect all convertible owners.
I would get your car back from the shop and let it dry out in your safe abode. Reading the posts - there have been very few positive experiences when using a shop or dealer to fix this.
Do you have a convertible top specialist in your area?
Thanks for the help, and it's nice just to know other people are around to offer support. I'm not rich, by any means, but this car has been a delight and I've put a lot of work into maintaining it, so being hit with something like this - especially when I feel like it's due to negligence from people I trusted to care for it - it's really depressing.
The local place that I've been using for years is the one who quoted me 2 to 8 hours (at $170/hr) to just diagnose the problem. They've been really good to me, so far, work on a lot of exotics, and have a traveling racing team. That large of a variance in cost is kind of hard for me to swallow, though, so I was hoping there were simple diagnostic steps I could take at home, first. Since it has had several days back home to dry off, I would love to just put the fuse back in and try the top again, but not knowing how that manual closing process impacts things I don't know if I have to do something else before trying it electronically. If anyone could weigh in on how to properly reset the roof after going through the manual locking process, that would be a big help.
The main folding top movement is powered by two motors both of which incorporate a FTCM (Folding
Top Control Module) . These two units are synchronized to perform a parallel movement of the folding
top. The left motor incorporates the master control module which is connected via the HS (High
Speed) CAN (Controller Area Network) powertrain systems bus to the ECM (Engine Control Module)
and various other vehicle control modules. The right motor incorporates the slave control module and
is connected via the HS CAN powertrain systems bus to the master control module and motor. Refer
to the Input/Output Diagram.
Two additional motors for front latch and rear down-lock are controlled by the FTCMs. The master
control module controls the front latch motor and the slave control module controls the rear down-
lock motor and consequently the cover flaps.
The micro-switches located adjacent to the main-bearing motors calculate the folding top position to
enable synchronisation of the motors.
Thank you for the link to the doc! It looks like page 1735 has instructions for manually opening it, but my lack of mechanical knowledge leaves me unsure as to what to do regarding the correct position of the motor shaft before trying to replace the fuse and operate it electronically. Also, if I want to manually close it again, it's at least a two person job to make sure it's pushed down into the lock position on both sides.
Last edited by BarneyChampaign; Apr 14, 2025 at 04:41 PM.
@BarneyChampaign Thinking about this like Colombo, the shop may have messed up your Quiescent Relay Box when they jumped the car, since that is the EXACT moment this problem started. That's actually good news because it doesn't involve tearing out the top and motors, plus kind of puts the responsibility on them if you want to go that route (and since you have past positive experiences with them).
Do you have a bidirectional OBD2 device (like iCarsoft for JLR)? If not this is a great time to order one so you are not at the mercy of the shop.
Check the trunk where the Quiescent Relay Box lives next to the positive terminal of the battery - is there any evidence of water or dampness? Any sign of corrosion? Disconnect the battery at the negative terminal. Pull all the fuses from the Quiescent Relay Box and see if any have blown. Pull out the large harness plugs then reseat them into the Quiescent Relay Box. Reconnect the battery. Clear the codes via OBD2 then recheck after starting the car. If all clear go ahead and replace the fuse and try the top.
The codes provide some clue here. The fact that your left and right motors are trying to open the roof is a good sign that its not a rain-saturated dead motor. The latch mechanism could be suspect but that is last on my list. Here is a post about clearing these specific codes by @Nitro66215 at: https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/f...-277107/page2/ - I have messaged him and our iCarsoft/SDD/Pathfinder/Everything expert @dennis black !
Last edited by JagCode3; Apr 15, 2025 at 08:31 AM.
@BarneyChampaign Thinking about this like Colombo, the shop may have messed up your Quiescent Relay Box when they jumped the car, since that is the EXACT moment this problem started. That's actually good news because it doesn't involve tearing out the top and motors, plus kind of puts the responsibility on them if you want to go that route (and since you have past positive experiences with them).
Do you have a bidirectional OBD2 device (like iCarsoft for JLR)? If not this is a great time to order one so you are not at the mercy of the shop.
Check the trunk where the Quiescent Relay Box lives next to the positive terminal of the battery - is there any evidence of water or dampness? Any sign of corrosion? Disconnect the battery at the negative terminal. Pull all the fuses from the Quiescent Relay Box and see if any have blown. Pull out the large harness plugs then reseat them into the Quiescent Relay Box. Reconnect the battery. Clear the codes via OBD2 then recheck after starting the car. If all clear go ahead and replace the fuse and try the top.
The codes provide some clue here. The fact that your left and right motors are trying to open the roof is a good sign that its not a rain-saturated dead motor. The latch mechanism could be suspect but that is last on my list. Here is a post about clearing these specific codes by @Nitro66215 at: https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/f...-277107/page2/ - I have messaged him and our iCarsoft/SDD/Pathfinder/Everything expert @dennis black !
I'm overwhelmed by all the support, thank you so much!
I don't have a code reader, but I'm happy to get one as it seems like a smart investment. Do you have one to recommend? I looked on Amazon and found several that say they work, but since they're so expensive I didn't want to make a mistake and get one that wouldn't be proper. If any stores carry them, I could make a trip to pick one up, as well.
I've got it in the shop right now, and the only code showing is loss of communication with the convertible top module. We tried to manually open the top, but cannot get it to open more than about 8 inches. Is there any procedure or method or tips for how to get it to fold back so we can actually access the motors and control modules?
@JagCode3
Thanks, yes I had seen this! I think page 1735 it started talking about doing the open procedure in the "reverse order" to open it, but the tech was unable to do so as the release screws on the hinges are not accessible while it is in the up position.
On another note, I'm curious – what is the general consensus when it comes to F-Type soft tops left out in hard, prolonged rain? The shop I used, when visiting my parents' house, had it sitting out in their lot for 8 days, completely uncovered. I just checked the past weather report to refresh myself and we got over 2 inches one day, moving into an additional inch the following day. I remember that storm, and it was pretty hard. If I had it with me, I would have made sure it was covered. At home, it's always stored covered in my garage, and at my parents' house if the weather forecast looks bad I go out and put a cover over it.
So, now that a borescope has shown me that the motor and control module have signs of corrosion and water damage, and because it worked before I brought it to them and only started acting up as soon as they put power to the battery (which now I believe was only dead because the control boards got wet and started drawing power) to jump it, I feel like they should be responsible in paying for the repair. My argument is that it was damaged by rain overflowing and drowning the modules, and that reasonable precautions and care would dictate that experts who specifically said they have experience with F-Types would, at minimum, throw a cover or tarp over it if the forecast calls for heavy, prolonged rain. Does that sound valid, or am I way off about what I consider "reasonable care"?
@BarneyChampaign I don't think that argument will work as these cars were supposedly designed by JLR to be parked outside and exposed to the elements of the UK, which gets its fair share of rain. Should they be? Of course not.
With rain pouring into the engine bay from the hood vents, rusting the intake bolts, seizing the injectors, and (in specifically the convertible) overwhelming the 2 small drain tubes and flooding the motors.
Did you tell them to park it inside while it was at the shop? If they left the windows open or trunk unlocked that is another story, but if you have a good relationship with them it's best to keep it that way. Find out what they will charge to fix it and decide from there.
So they were able to take a look with a borescope at the motors? You should also check the area under the supercharger for standing water and corrosion. It could just be one circuit that is affected by the water, and the motors may still function.
Convertible top constantly trying to open while car is on.
